ansharp wrote:This discussion started off productive and now has been (as usual) marred by ugly personal attacks.
I feel the need to apologize. I didn't mean to attack Adder personally, and yet I did. He's just so infuriating for me to read sometimes. He called kdeuce a hack just in this derby, and I was fresh off reading that when I came across this discussion. I don't know Adder personally, so it would be unfair of me to make judgments...but that's kind of my point. I don't disagree with Adder on everything, many of his complaints about Woot have validity. But please please cut out the condescension towards others. I have every right to like Kdeuce's art and not appreciate Adder's. It doesn't mean I lack taste, it just means I have a different taste.
1. I said the other artists could sue, but I didn't say they'd win. In all likelihood, they'd just be offended. Do I think kdeuce went over to Threadless and said, "Where's a good idea that I can copy for this derby?" No, of course not, and I would never imply such a thing.
And if they were to be offended at kdeuce, shouldn't they already be? I mean, each of them had their same idea executed by 2 others, didn't they? I really feel as if none of them would have the right to be offended, as they also executed the same idea differently. Kdeuce could be offended that they had already done his idea, only not as well. I think there is plenty of room for different interpretations of the same idea in the art world. In fact, there NEEDS to be.
2. It is difficult to create something new, that is true, but many people do it every week. Should ideas that have already been proven to succeed be allowed in a competition against creative ones? That is a sincere question, but I imagine I won't agree with most of the responses.
I won't delve too deeply into this one, as I can see your point clearly. But just try to imagine Woot policing not just the rules of the derby that week (which is already felt to be inconsistent), but then trying to police whether or not a CONCEPT is "new" or "has been done too much." While some might applaud the removal of turtles and birds and octopus, where does it end? What happens when dogs win 2 weeks in a row, and the next week a wonderful dog entry gets rejected just because it was being used too much? Just imagine the new problems we'd see on the boards then.
4. Yes, some people prefer to use the woot derbies to display their original art instead of catering to the masses in order to win. We would all like to win, but won't sacrifice our integrity to do so. I know at least one person who never expects to get more than 20 or so votes (even though her stuff is great and very unique) and mostly enters for the hope of woot noticing and awarding her with an HM.
And if that is the case, more power to them. But do you really think that a person who chooses to use the Derbies as nothing more than to display their art has any right to bash the voters for not choosing it? Remember, the voters are the ones who are going to buy. What sense would it make for Woot to print the ones on the bottom when they have thousands of people wanting to buy the ones on the top?
6. He is not the only person around here who consistently despises the voters choices. He's just the only one willing to sacrifice his good name for the cause. When more and more people are speaking up and saying they agree with the voice of dissent, doesn't that usually signal a problem?
This is absolutely my point! You have a right to despise the voters' choices...every bit as much right, in fact, as the voters themselves have the right to vote! However, you absolutely have no more right than they do. You have every right to disagree with them, and every right to express yourself. You'll notice I'm not upset with your disagreeing, actually nothing you have said has bothered me slightly, I am upset with Adder's condescension and dare I say, "unsportsmanlike conduct."
There isn't a game I know of where it is acceptable behavior to call your fellow competitors losers, call them all manner of names, berate them for their stupidity, and then go into the stands of the opposing team and tell them their opinions suck and they are morons for being fans. Not and be taken seriously anyway.
Adder can continue to disagree all he wants. I agree with him that I'd like to see more creativity. I'd like to see more consistent rejections and more accountability. However, be respectful. Even if you hated kdeuce's entry last week, the fact remains it received 2000 votes and has sold almost 4000 shirts in just over a week. A dose of reality would state that Woot is unlikely to reject entries that so many people vote on and sell so many copies just because it is a "formula shirt." (even though I personally disagree with that assessment).
Cut the condescension and hatred and even I agree with Adder.