Shirt.Woot

Shmuel510 wrote:Thanks. And my sincere apologies for using the wrong pronoun! (I made a faulty inference from the reference to you in the "Let's Talk Lady Sizes" blog post.)

No worries. Being called a woman isn't an insult.

llandar wrote:Mea culpa. I am easily riled and was picked on as a child, so I tend to lash out with words. I will do my best to dial down the sarcasm when in the forums here.

Well that's saddening.

If anyone makes similar snarky comments about goldenthorn that results in her changing her tone, I shall have to be MOST unhappy.

People. Yes, these are big changes. But lighten up! Heck, isn't that lighter tone what we like about woot? Expecting someone to coddle you because this represents the biggest tragedy in your life just screams 'I can not cope with life and hide on the internet to pretend I am an adult'. There are lot of clothing manufacturers that change sizing and sources without any sort of communication to the consumer. Make your choice, and be happy with it. No need for drama.

redpikachu wrote:I'm such a huge fan, I have actually visited their factory in LA several times. Did you know the pay for a seamstress there starts at $12/hour? How much are the people in some foreign country getting paid to make your imported shirts?

The figures I have for Honduras is about $8/day.

This is unrelated to the topic at hand, but if you have an hour, watch China Blue ... and think about where your clothes is coming from the next time you go shopping. And understand why some of us have a the stance that we do when it comes to imported goods.

Narfcake wrote:The figures I have for Honduras is about $8/day.

This is unrelated to the topic at hand, but if you have an hour, watch China Blue ... and think about where your clothes is coming from the next time you go shopping. And understand why some of us have a the stance that we do when it comes to imported goods.

I am glad to see back on this thread... You haven't posted for a while and I was starting to worry...

I watched the video you linked a couple of pages ago... I stand with you.

1. Denial
2. Anger
3. Bargaining
4. Depression
5. Acceptance <--Are we there yet?

llandar wrote:No worries. Being called a woman isn't an insult.

Good to know, Randall.

might as well throw my hat in the ring. i'm not angry at the price hike. i'm not angry about the anvil shirts themselves. times are hard. jobs are scarce. why take the shirts out of the country when we have the means to make them here? i'm not saying i won't buy another shirt. i might if it strikes my fancy. but it will make me question it a little harder...

llandar wrote:Yes. We created this post and encouraged you guys to comment so we could ignore it.

No. You created this post to divert the outcry from the daily shirt.woot discussions so that it is easier for the subject to be muffled, and less noticeable for the casual buyer. Obviously a good PR move...

What can you do anyways, other than ignore it and let it die down? It's not like you could do anything to change the decision or justify the unjustifiable...

j5 wrote:1. Denial
2. Anger
3. Bargaining
4. Depression
5. Acceptance <--Are we there yet?

No.

llandar wrote:Mea culpa. I am easily riled and was picked on as a child, so I tend to lash out with words. I will do my best to dial down the sarcasm when in the forums here.

In that case, I'll do my best to make 'cute' designs.


I bet we're both as successful. ;^)

goldenthorn wrote:YOU SHUTUP I AM FABULOUSLY NICE & GENEROUSLY HELPFUL MAYBE I SHOULD PROBATE YOU HUH

That sounds like a euphemism. :D A FUN euphemism.

We need clint eastwood in a commercial to talk about the American spirit... its halftime in America and the second half is about to begin... and will all be wearing honduran shirts lol.

As another tall man, I want to also request that shirt.woot add Large Tall as a size option. At 6'5" woot shirts were already just barely long enough. 3/8" is a big deal to us tall people.

taternuggets wrote:I think you're interpreting this incorrectly. If it was a "message", I think I would see the relationships as Woot and American Apparel, not Woot and Amazon.

In order to continue their relationship, AA would need to meet the demands and standards set forth by Woot. They didn't and got replaced.

That's my take on it.

Or perhaps it wasn't a "message" at all.

This was my take on it as well. (Between Woot and AA)

Mavyn wrote:That sounds like a euphemism. :D A FUN euphemism.

bom chicka wah wah

goldenthorn wrote:YOU SHUTUP I AM FABULOUSLY NICE & GENEROUSLY HELPFUL MAYBE I SHOULD PROBATE YOU HUH

Can I get probated, too? I really just kind of want the doggie. Not the posting restriction. You know, like wearing a tough looking leather jacket and driving a sedan.

thumperchick wrote:Can I get probated, too? I really just kind of want the doggie. Not the posting restriction. You know, like wearing a tough looking leather jacket and driving a sedan.

They don't give you that anymore. Too many people were being rude just to get the probation hound.

maybe shirt.woot should send us all a free sample shirt to see if we can notice a difference in size and material...?
afterall, they are saving a lot by switching to anvil...

It's worth noting (and maybe I'm way too late to the game with this) that no American jobs were lost, here. AA is still in business, Shirt still uses them for some things, and they won't shutter their doors because of us.

I understand people are mad about the overall trend of outsourcing or whatever, but in this case it was an overall net gain of jobs (granted, those jobs are not in the US).

Also, due to the bizarre and complex world economy, Honduras imports a lot of US cotton while simultaneously exporting a lot of cotton right back to us. Obviously this is just anecdotal and I have no figures on it, but it's possible the new shirts are made with US cotton and the old were Honduran. Not that that's a justification of any kind, just a weird quirk of economics.

I've purchased woot tees since '07, mostly for my wife and daughter. I can't really speak to the quality of AA or Anvil myself but the AA have always met with my wife's approval. I was kind of disappointed when the price went up but since they were just an occasional surprise, I just accepted it. However, the switch to a non-US made shirt really upsets me as I always felt good about buying the shirts because of that. I'll probably buy the occasional shirt still but not nearly at the frequency I used to. Just disappointing.

Mavyn wrote:They don't give you that anymore.

*cough*notinshirtwoot*cough*

The idea that Woot should explain why they had a price increase right before switching to cheaper blanks is odd to me. Since any blank they'd switch to would most likely be cheaper. AA has one of more expensive shirt blanks you can get.

raccoonbacon wrote:Oh, i care about the Honduran and Nicaraguan people... Just not as much as i care about my fellow countrymen (women included).

If an American is going to buy something they can either choose to 1) purchase something made in this country or 2) save a few dollars and buy something that is not. It is their choice, but i would hope that most Americans choose option 1...

We're all humans.

Just so we are clear, you'd rather support the people who were lucky enough to have been born in the landmass known as the United States, and not the landmass known as the world?

kipin wrote:We're all humans.

Just so we are clear, you'd rather support the people who were lucky enough to have been born in the landmass known as the United States, and not the landmass known as the world?

Yup and yup.

I am sorry if my sense of national pride disturbs you...

llandar wrote:It's worth noting (and maybe I'm way too late to the game with this) that no American jobs were lost, here.

... yet.

Woot goes through 50,000+ shirts a month. That HAS to have an impact.

As the nightly number nerd, I'll tally some figures tonight.

AA is still in business, Shirt still uses them for some things, and they won't shutter their doors because of us.

The long sleeve sales have been very minor compared to the regular short sleeves. I've been tracking those figures too.

llandar wrote:It's worth noting (and maybe I'm way too late to the game with this) that no American jobs were lost, here. AA is still in business, Shirt still uses them for some things, and they won't shutter their doors because of us.

I understand people are mad about the overall trend of outsourcing or whatever, but in this case it was an overall net gain of jobs (granted, those jobs are not in the US).

Also, due to the bizarre and complex world economy, Honduras imports a lot of US cotton while simultaneously exporting a lot of cotton right back to us. Obviously this is just anecdotal and I have no figures on it, but it's possible the new shirts are made with US cotton and the old were Honduran. Not that that's a justification of any kind, just a weird quirk of economics.

I don't see how you can say taking business away from one company (AA) wont lose jobs, but giving business to another company (Anvil) will create jobs. That just doesn't make sense.

Narfcake wrote:Woot goes through 50,000+ shirts a month. That HAS to have an impact.

An impact, certainly. But a company saying "Shirt.Woot is our only customer and if we lose them we'll just collapse" is as dumb as Shirt.Woot saying "This is our one and only supplier for everything so I hope nothing bad ever happens to them."

llandar wrote:An impact, certainly. But a company saying "Shirt.Woot is our only customer and if we lose them we'll just collapse" is as dumb as Shirt.Woot saying "This is our one and only supplier for everything so I hope nothing bad ever happens to them."

No one said they would collapse. Simply that cutting out 40-50k shirts/week will cost someone at AA their job. Also - the money paid for those shirts are now leaving the US. Inferring that someone has is just as ridiculous, or "dumb" as you not-so-elegently put it. Really though, your discourse here is making me realize that although woot asked us for our opinions, they aren't welcome. Which has been shown by your consistent defensiveness and disrespect of your customers in this thread.

I'm realizing that while you may be a talented writer, your ability to remain calm and professional in a customer service setting is lacking greatly. Adding insult is unnecessary.

What this thread should have said is, "Ask the questions we are comfortable asking, lest you be mocked for having a dissenting opinion."

Ridiculous.

Why would AA build a factory in downtown LA? I can't imagine that was the most financially prudent place to locate, even if one wanted to locate in the US.

LA doesn't exactly scream "textile capital of the US" to me, but it does scream "expensive cost-of-doing-business"

thumperchick wrote:No one said they would collapse. Simply that cutting out 40-50k shirts/week will cost someone at AA their job. Also - the money paid for those shirts are now leaving the US. Inferring that someone has is just as ridiculous, or "dumb" as you not-so-elegently put it. Really though, your discourse here is making me realize that although woot asked us for our opinions, they aren't welcome. Which has been shown by your consistent defensiveness and disrespect of your customers in this thread.

I'm realizing that while you may be a talented writer, your ability to remain calm and professional in a customer service setting is lacking greatly. Adding insult is unnecessary.

What this thread should have said is, "Ask the questions we are comfortable asking, lest you be mocked for having a dissenting opinion."

Ridiculous.

Frankly, I haven't seen anything at all different in this thread than any other thread on woot. sure, llandar is a little mocking, but face it, we all need to be mocked on occasion, and this strikes me as one of those occasions. Personally, I think Snapster ought to be the one getting mocked here, not the poor writer.

heh, I didn't mean llandar was poor at writing, just that he's the unfortunate who's stepped up to the plate. Since the early days of woot, they've been snarky, even when they were doing unpopular things. why should that change now?

llandar wrote:An impact, certainly. But a company saying "Shirt.Woot is our only customer and if we lose them we'll just collapse" is as dumb as Shirt.Woot saying "This is our one and only supplier for everything so I hope nothing bad ever happens to them."

It's almost as dumb as "We've maintained a business relationship for years that delivered a desirable product to the consumers at a great price ... so let's raise prices and change that product so my boss gets a bigger paycheck!", right? I mean, that's just so absolutely absurd!

Oh wait ...

Please, don't take any of this personally. I'm not here to attack you. Likewise, we have yet to have a truly honest answer to why the change in suppliers - and so, some of us will continue to poke, prod, and theorize as to the why.

ThunderThighs wrote:Uhm, I know it's been a bit but if you go back to the first post of this thread, I think you'll see it was to announce and explain the change. Obviously discussion would happen on this thread but it sure hasn't stopped it from being discussed in the daily thread either. In fact, we are doing our best to be sure people know about the change in that thread by posting the gold box notice that it's printed on Anvil on every page.

Hello ThunderThighs!

Yes, the original post was to announce and explain the changes that were happening but I have not seen a response addressing the numerous comments regarding the price increase very closely followed by the announcement of changing blank vendors.

We have yet to hear the shirt.woot overlords negate the fact that the Anvil blanks are considerably cheaper than the AA brand and how the $2 increase justifies the reason for the increase to begin with...

The community (and it says that right in the upper left-hand corner of the blog) is just asking for better clarification of what has transpired. And we are not looking for snarky, sarcastic answers like the tidbits that we have been given. As much as it is the way that certain individuals believe they need to respond, they are actually doing more harm than good.

I don't expect the corporate secrets of the people making all the decisions; just a honest, thoughtful reply.

Thank You.

tsfisch wrote:Why would AA build a factory in downtown LA? I can't imagine that was the most financially prudent place to locate, even if one wanted to locate in the US.

LA doesn't exactly scream "textile capital of the US" to me, but it does scream "expensive cost-of-doing-business"

Have you ever been to downtown LA's fashion district? It's like a desert full of factories and bolts of fabric. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fashion_District_%28Los_Angeles%29

thumperchick wrote:Also - the money paid for those shirts are now leaving the US.

Anvil is based in NYC. While the costs of production (i.e. wages) might go to central America, most of the money goes to (US) Americans.

Does anyone else find themselves wishing, like I am a tiny bit, that Adder was around to contribute his opinion to the discussion at hand? I'm sure he would have had a thing or two to say about all this...

redpikachu wrote:Have you ever been to downtown LA's fashion district? It's like a desert full of factories and bolts of fabric. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fashion_District_%28Los_Angeles%29

If you've ever been to The Santee Alley and had one of these, you'd think it was a paradise.

Which style(s) of Anvil shirt will Woot be using?

If my internet sleuthing skills are still working, the potential new style of men's shirts is the 490
http://www.anvilknitwear.com/Product-Catalogs/Tees/490

or
the 989
http://www.anvilknitwear.com/Product-Catalogs/Tees/989

I really think it's the 490 because that style is organic, it's the same sizing listed on shirt.woot, and it has a silver color tee (the 989 does, too, but is not organic). Maybe that it's organic will ease the suffering minds of those upset with the switch? IDK. You can't make everyone happy all the time.

llandar wrote:
Also, due to the bizarre and complex world economy, Honduras imports a lot of US cotton while simultaneously exporting a lot of cotton right back to us. Obviously this is just anecdotal and I have no figures on it, but it's possible the new shirts are made with US cotton and the old were Honduran. Not that that's a justification of any kind, just a weird quirk of economics.

This only perpetuates the American trade deficit and other problems as we essentially become a "third world nation" when we export raw goods that only create a few more menial jobs then import the finished product it creates an paradigm that many third world nations face today.