bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation

I feel like what I write here is going to get lost, but here goes:

I dont love the new blanks compared to AA either, but I will continue to buy Woot's tees for one reason: Artist/Staff Support.

While I support US jobs, we have to remember that Woot also employs American workers. You can watch the video here of the good people printing these tees . They're working hard for us, and they live in the US. The staff lives in the USA, as does the web developers, the people who ship our shirts, process our orders and answer our emails, etc. Woot IS an American company with American workers.

Also, I continue to stay here for the artists. I love this community and I've gotten to know a lot of my fellow arters over my years here. I can't stop supporting them over the shirt blanks :\. The fact of our world is, most of our manufactured products are made overseas. Nobody likes it, but it's how the changing world does it's business.

Just my personal feelings. The world isnt perfect, and very few businesses are perfect. I choose to try and support the good parts of everything I can. :\

chennai8


quality posts: 2 Private Messages chennai8
bassanimation wrote:I feel like what I write here is going to get lost.



First of all, I have great respect for artists. But wear their art on an inferior product. Not so much!

Also supporting woot / woot staff? They have five their sites and owned by Amazon. I'm not saying this to undermine your stand, just my opinion.

neyfam2000 wrote:Woot!--going from "Deal-a-day" to "Site-a-day"

Mavyn


quality posts: 22 Private Messages Mavyn
chennai8 wrote:First of all, I have great respect for artists. But wear their art on an inferior product. Not so much!

Also supporting woot / woot staff? They have five their sites and owned by Amazon. I'm not saying this to undermine your stand, just my opinion.



But American Apparel is worthy of our support? From all the woot employees I've talked to, Woot is a very good place to work. American Apparel has tons of complaints by former employees. Not to mention, AA is still GETTING woot support. Notice the v-necks? Long sleeves? Yep, not in the volume previously seen, but I'd be surprised if anyone lost their AA job as a result.

My speech is not parsing. I am speaking in ellipsis.

chennai8


quality posts: 2 Private Messages chennai8
Mavyn wrote:But American Apparel is worthy of our support? From all the woot employees I've talked to, Woot is a very good place to work. American Apparel has tons of complaints by former employees. Not to mention, AA is still GETTING woot support. Notice the v-necks? Long sleeves? Yep, not in the volume previously seen, but I'd be surprised if anyone lost their AA job as a result.



This is not AA vs. Woot. Also my main concern is the quality, not nationality.

neyfam2000 wrote:Woot!--going from "Deal-a-day" to "Site-a-day"

elankat


quality posts: 7 Private Messages elankat
bassanimation wrote:I feel like what I write here is going to get lost, but here goes:

I dont love the new blanks compared to AA either, but I will continue to buy Woot's tees for one reason: Artist/Staff Support.



Admirable, but not everyone is willing to buy a shirt that looks horrible just to support the artists. Imo, the bell shaped, big sleeved Anvil shirts look pretty horrible.

BootsBoots


quality posts: 38 Private Messages BootsBoots
bassanimation wrote:I feel like what I write here is going to get lost, but here goes:

I dont love the new blanks compared to AA either, but I will continue to buy Woot's tees for one reason: Artist/Staff Support.

While I support US jobs, we have to remember that Woot also employs American workers. You can watch the video here of the good people printing these tees . They're working hard for us, and they live in the US. The staff lives in the USA, as does the web developers, the people who ship our shirts, process our orders and answer our emails, etc. Woot IS an American company with American workers.

Also, I continue to stay here for the artists. I love this community and I've gotten to know a lot of my fellow arters over my years here. I can't stop supporting them over the shirt blanks :\. The fact of our world is, most of our manufactured products are made overseas. Nobody likes it, but it's how the changing world does it's business.

Just my personal feelings. The world isnt perfect, and very few businesses are perfect. I choose to try and support the good parts of everything I can. :\



elankat wrote:Admirable, but not everyone is willing to buy a shirt that looks horrible just to support the artists. Imo, the bell shaped, big sleeved Anvil shirts look pretty horrible.



I agree with both of these. I'd be willing to buy something not made in the USA (I mean, I do it all the time, anyway). I want to support Woot, and especially to support the artists (of course!). But, I'm not willing to buy a shirt that looks bad on me to do that. I'll still buy men's shirts as gifts. But, it's not like I frequently go around buying shirts to give to various men or anything. I mean, I'm not going to be checking Woot every day to see if I'd like to buy the current shirt as a gift for someone. I'm not that nice.


Mavyn


quality posts: 22 Private Messages Mavyn

I agree that the fit on the women's shirts is tragic. I sent the blank sample I got, WXL, to my sister. She normally wears an AA WL or WXL, and she was shocked at how big it was, after washing. So, yeah, I get THAT as a legitimate reason not to buy Woot shirts.

I wear men's tees because I have wide shoulders and am tall. In women's, I either buy a tall or I don't buy. *shrugs*

My speech is not parsing. I am speaking in ellipsis.

thatrobert


quality posts: 28 Private Messages thatrobert
BootsBoots wrote:I agree with both of these. I'd be willing to buy something not made in the USA (I mean, I do it all the time, anyway). I want to support Woot, and especially to support the artists (of course!). But, I'm not willing to buy a shirt that looks bad on me to do that. I'll still buy men's shirts as gifts. But, it's not like I frequently go around buying shirts to give to various men or anything. I mean, I'm not going to be checking Woot every day to see if I'd like to buy the current shirt as a gift for someone. I'm not that nice.



Well said. I'd love to find a way to be on board with the blank change and continue to support artists, but the quality was so bad it's not possible.

Darquis


quality posts: 27 Private Messages Darquis
mrwednesday wrote:When you raise prices and state that it is because your current materials are increasing in cost and specifically mention them by name (blanks in this case), and then sit and listen while the community breathes a sigh of relief that the materials won't change and say nothing all the while knowing you are about to announce a change in the supplier to a less desirable one it is at the very best disingenuous. You're unbelievably naive if you can convince yourself otherwise.

So about that bridge......



And announcing the change at that time would have been much better, of course, because...well, I can't actually think of a reason - people would still be all gung ho about America, and pissed about the increase combined with the change, so what does telling people early accomplish other than telling people early?

mrwednesday


quality posts: 12 Private Messages mrwednesday
Darquis wrote:And announcing the change at that time would have been much better, of course, because...well, I can't actually think of a reason - people would still be all gung ho about America, and pissed about the increase combined with the change, so what does telling people early accomplish other than telling people early?



You've conceded the point. Time to move along.

I will, however, answer your question. What it accomplishes is actually involving the community rather than pretending they did. There's a lot of big talk from woot about how important the community is and how much they value that back and forth, but there is no reciprocity.

The change was made unilaterally. The explanation came after they had already let the cat out of the bag. When the blanks went on sale I said here comes a shift to foreign production, and the same people trying to defend them now were yelling and screaming, "why don't we wait till something happens...You don't know that's what's coming...woot has earned the benefit of the doubt..."

No they haven't. Look at this thread. The only feedback from woot is Ilandar mocking people's concerns and everyone else cheerleading how "AWESOMEOMGWTF!!!" the new blanks are. No legitimate concerns and have addressed, and shipping out the samples was a bandaid after the situation blew up on them and it was suggested by a community member.

They never would have thought of doing that on their own because they never intended to take into account or care about the feelings of the community. It has been damage control from day 1. I suppose you can commend them for actually listening and responding to the community in that tiny instance but it goes far short of what a community driven company should be doing.

Not to mention shipping out the shirts probably cost them less than $100. Wow, I'm really impressed that a site easily netting more than $150 grand a week threw some change at the masses. Huge sacrifice....

bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation
elankat wrote:Admirable, but not everyone is willing to buy a shirt that looks horrible just to support the artists. Imo, the bell shaped, big sleeved Anvil shirts look pretty horrible.



Totally see you point here, guys. The Anvil tees definitely dont support smaller framed women as well as the AA's did. :\

I was trying more to underline my stance on the issue as a whole. I understand that some here simply dont like the new blanks' fit, so they wont be buying as many shirts (or any shirts). If I had a super petite (and less mammarific top) I'd be pretty peeved as well. Fortunately the new shirts arent too bad on me, so I can live with them for now. Foooorr nooooow, buwahahahaaa! <---Scooby Doo ending

bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation
BootsBoots wrote:I agree with both of these. I'd be willing to buy something not made in the USA (I mean, I do it all the time, anyway). I want to support Woot, and especially to support the artists (of course!). But, I'm not willing to buy a shirt that looks bad on me to do that.




Maybe the staff can look into an WXS option, or at least hang onto the AA WM/WS for smaller girls. It does make me incredibly sad to see that svelte framed Woot ladies are having such an issue with the Anvils. :{

dreamaster2


quality posts: 0 Private Messages dreamaster2

Why should they cater to females only?

ochopika


quality posts: 28 Private Messages ochopika

Staff

dreamaster2 wrote:Why should they cater to females only?



It seems like the ladies sizes were just more of a problem than the men's. First they were too small and straight, now they're too big and...weirdly bell-shaped.
No one really complained about the fit of the AA men's sizes except a few wanted one size larger. The Anvil men's sizes seem to be OKAY as far as I've read. So yea, it's just that everyone is focused on the ladies right now...but maybe we'll get a MXS too.

bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation
ochopika wrote:It seems like the ladies sizes were just more of a problem than the men's. First they were too small and straight, now they're too big and...weirdly bell-shaped.
No one really complained about the fit of the AA men's sizes except a few wanted one size larger. The Anvil men's sizes seem to be OKAY as far as I've read. So yea, it's just that everyone is focused on the ladies right now...but maybe we'll get a MXS too.



True. Women's bodies tend to vary a -lot- more than men's. Nobody is asking Woot to cater to just the women, but women do make a good portion of the buyers. It's a good idea to make sure as many girls as possible can find a decent size.

trekmiss


quality posts: 8 Private Messages trekmiss

I am a woman that still has to wear men's sizes. I currently wear MXL in AA. I was hopeful that the new Anvil WXL may work, but I can tell that it is way too short. I haven't seen anything from larger women who have tested the new men's blanks, but from what little I have seen about the Anvil mens, the sleeves are going to be too long, and the shirt will be too short. That pretty much leaves me with no choices, well, at least none that will look good on me. When randoms come around, I may give it a try, but I'm not feeling very optimistic about it.

outer78


quality posts: 13 Private Messages outer78

Im just a little curious if one of the first questions was ever answered.

Why the $2 price hike when they switched to cheaper shirts?

I read through the first couple pages and checked the "quality posts" but didn't seem to see anything. I also didn't want to attempt to find something that may not be there in the 20+ pages.

Narfcake


quality posts: 292 Private Messages Narfcake
outer78 wrote:Im just a little curious if one of the first questions was ever answered.

Why the $2 price hike when they switched to cheaper shirts?


More profit + even more profit.

redhairedgeek


quality posts: 1 Private Messages redhairedgeek

I bought 68 blanks. Those will be the last woot shirts I buy

dioxazine


quality posts: 0 Private Messages dioxazine
bassanimation wrote:Maybe the staff can look into an WXS option, or at least hang onto the AA WM/WS for smaller girls. It does make me incredibly sad to see that svelte framed Woot ladies are having such an issue with the Anvils. :{



I don't believe a WXS option will solve the horrible shape of these shirts. Shoot, a lot of the females that I've read that can fit in these shirts (like myself) don't even want to wear them. They might as well have added 15lbs to my frame since I look like I'm now pregnant in them (I wore the AA WXL now a WM).

Maybe keeping the old female AA shirts as a "junior" size option?

I'm so bummed by all this, I loved my woot shirts so much and now I see all these great designs and know I can't wear them because they will look horrible.

elankat


quality posts: 7 Private Messages elankat
bassanimation wrote:Totally see you point here, guys. The Anvil tees definitely dont support smaller framed women as well as the AA's did. :\

I was trying more to underline my stance on the issue as a whole. I understand that some here simply dont like the new blanks' fit, so they wont be buying as many shirts (or any shirts). If I had a super petite (and less mammarific top) I'd be pretty peeved as well. Fortunately the new shirts arent too bad on me, so I can live with them for now. Foooorr nooooow, buwahahahaaa! <---Scooby Doo ending



I wouldn't consider myself a smaller framed woman. I'm completely average height, normal bmi gal with boobs & broad shoulders. I was an AA WXL to comfortably house the girls. I wasn't a fan of AA (company or shirt fit), but the new shirts look awful imo.

I'm actually pretty sad about the whole thing since I enjoyed trying to save shirts in the Reckoning, even though I wasn't thrilled with AA's fit on me. Loved the AA fit for my kids & DH though. When they announced new blanks, I was really excited because I was hoping for a better fitting women's blank. So disappointed.

bck9900


quality posts: 1 Private Messages bck9900
bassanimation wrote:I feel like what I write here is going to get lost, but here goes:

Just my personal feelings. The world isnt perfect, and very few businesses are perfect. I choose to try and support the good parts of everything I can. :\



While you make a good point that would be like saying Dell is an American company because they do SOME manugacturing in the United States. I prefer my products made in the US, its one small thing I can do to help the economy and our GDP. Of course I expect to pay a few dollars more but in the end it is generally worth it.

raccoonbacon


quality posts: 1 Private Messages raccoonbacon
bassanimation wrote:mammarific



I know this is slightly off-topic, but if there is anything in this discussion that can bring a smile to people's faces, it is the use of the word above...

Thank you, bassanimation!

j5


quality posts: 63 Private Messages j5
mrwednesday wrote:The only feedback from woot is Ilandar mocking people's concerns and everyone else cheerleading how "AWESOMEOMGWTF!!!" the new blanks are. No legitimate concerns and have addressed, and shipping out the samples was a bandaid after the situation blew up on them and it was suggested by a community member.

From the men's perspective, I see very little such cheerleading. From the women's perspective, I see the opposite. In fact, sending out blanks to women likely convinced them to stop purchasing.

move along

bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation
bck9900 wrote:While you make a good point that would be like saying Dell is an American company because they do SOME manugacturing in the United States. I prefer my products made in the US, its one small thing I can do to help the economy and our GDP. Of course I expect to pay a few dollars more but in the end it is generally worth it.



No American job is worth more than another American job. They're all people. The secretary at Dell has a family to support as well. That's about all I care to say on the matter, as this topic gets a little too close to politics for me.

bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation
raccoonbacon wrote:I know this is slightly off-topic, but if there is anything in this discussion that can bring a smile to people's faces, it is the use of the word above...

Thank you, bassanimation!



I figure this topic is getting a bit heavy, so any talk of mammarificness is welcome, hahaha. Smile away!

Mavyn


quality posts: 22 Private Messages Mavyn

Does the fact that American Apparel is not US owned play in to this argument?

Just curious.

My speech is not parsing. I am speaking in ellipsis.

Narfcake


quality posts: 292 Private Messages Narfcake
Mavyn wrote:Does the fact that American Apparel is not US owned play in to this argument?

Just curious.


It's played in this thread.

Mavyn


quality posts: 22 Private Messages Mavyn

Not really. It's mentioned that a Canadian firm reinvested in them, but not stated--AA is NOT an US-owned company. Complain about money going elsewhere with Anvil...sure, but same is happening with AA. The vast majority of AA employees are not in America.

My speech is not parsing. I am speaking in ellipsis.

techound1


quality posts: 0 Private Messages techound1

Just received my first t-on-an-Anvil. It's awful quality. Awful. Neck is huge (bacon neck, anyone?). Size is out of whack. Seriously, last woot t will buy*. And I've had a lot over the years. Sad days, my friends. Sad days.


*I would like to say "last until you return to AA shirts" but in this world I'm not parking at woot waiting for you to come to your senses. I'm sorry you guys felt this was the right way to go.

trickycoolj


quality posts: 0 Private Messages trickycoolj

Been keeping an eye on the drastic change in women's shirts. Based on what I've seen nothing will fit me properly unless I start ordering a Mens size and that means sleeves to my elbows, and too long shoulders, it just looks off. Anyway, when doing my laundry I remembered I had a freebie ladies tee from PAX that I consistently wear to lounge around the house (the design is a giant ad for D&D Online). It's a Hanes Silver Label women's shirt. It has a little more of a hourglass shape, but doesn't stretch as many have reported the Anvils did. I believe it shrunk a little shorter but not obnoxiously so, I can still workout in it and not have my tummy hang out when my arms are lifted. Might be worth looking into. FWIW I'm an AAWL and this Hanes shirt fits in WS but WM would be better (couldn't pick size on the freebie) so it might offer a better women's range.

*Edit: spell check whoops.

dilettante


quality posts: 0 Private Messages dilettante
techound1 wrote:Just received my first t-on-an-Anvil. It's awful quality. Awful. Neck is huge (bacon neck, anyone?). Size is out of whack. Seriously, last woot t will buy*. And I've had a lot over the years. Sad days, my friends. Sad days.



I used "Too Many Cooks" as my trial. The fit (ML) is just weird: loose around the neck and shoulders, yet uncomfortably tight around the middle (not for the slightly overweight, I guess!). I'm also wondering how many washes it will take before the fabric feels as soft as the AA blanks did straight out of the package.

The AA was form fitting, equally tight in all areas... just comfortable!

mrwednesday


quality posts: 12 Private Messages mrwednesday
Mavyn wrote:Not really. It's mentioned that a Canadian firm reinvested in them, but not stated--AA is NOT an US-owned company. Complain about money going elsewhere with Anvil...sure, but same is happening with AA. The vast majority of AA employees are not in America.



I think people are really getting lost in all this. I for one couldn't care less where the profits are going. It's not about where the management is. It's about the working conditions. I don't think they have sweat shops for CEO's in Canada or even Honduras...

It's about the manufacturing being done in a place where workers are afforded reasonable wages and lawful protections from abuse. It's about the factories being required to limit their environmental footprint. No matter how much of an Yakko Dov Charney is those things don't just disappear in the US. How many times has he been sued? Think that happens in Honduras? The same protections do not exist in places where labor is being outsourced to and that is why they are being outsourced.

heidiruth


quality posts: 12 Private Messages heidiruth

Well, my "Blending in to Night" came today (the Ninja chameleon shirt)...and even though the thread stated "Ladies/Kids = AA" I received my WM on Anvil.

I'm not here to complain about that necessarily - I already emailed woot and have confidence they won't leave me hanging, I hope. But the funny thing is, the second I opened up the bag and felt the material, I knew that it was the wrong blank. Not to say that it's a terrible material, but it's no AA. My boyfriend's random 3 pack of blanks had just shown up, too, so a quick side-by-side unwashed comparison really showed how inferior the quality was.

Also, as expected from someone who normally wears an AA WM, the Anvil WM is gigantic. And I think the "curves" in it are ridiculous. I have big hips, and still don't stand a chance.

adamselby


quality posts: 2 Private Messages adamselby

Today's Woot shirt is the first shirt I've wanted to buy that isn't on AA. I guess that's just proof the end is coming for my Woot shirt love.. The price increase I can totally bear, I'd even be willing to pay $14 per shirt for AA blanks, assuming that artist compensation went up a little bit. Bump the price on the reckoning to $18, and I'm sure Woot would still be making great money.

I hope there's another change soon in the future.

Kitzira


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Kitzira

Ad nauseam about the whole woman's anvil sizes. I've a closet side full of woot shirts in AAWM. They wash well, and fit like a woman's shirt should.

I pulled "Too Many Cooks" out of the bag (not realizing that it was a victim of the change over), and thought they gave me a men's shirt instead. This is supposed to a woman's medium size, but it could easily fit my boyfriend instead if he tried.

I was thinking I could try a small, but this thread leads me to believe this may be a futile battle.

For stat use, I'm a 5'7" 115lb woman, typically I buy medium sized shirts in the stores.

chemnerd


quality posts: 0 Private Messages chemnerd
bassanimation wrote:Fortunately the new shirts arent too bad on me, so I can live with them for now.



This is the nicest thing I've heard about the shirts in at least several threads "arent too bad". And that's exactly what's wrong with it all.


ThugNatty


quality posts: 1 Private Messages ThugNatty

The 77% Anvil states as it's ratio of unionized workers is almost certainly to do with some Solidarismo program. The Solidarista movement rapidly gained popularity among Latin America farm and industry owners as a means to minimize labor disputes. It is in no way a true union because it strips member of their collective bargaining rights. It is referred to as a "union of employer and employee", where membership dues are collected and matched by the business owners, who then decide how the money will be invested into surrounding public infrastructure. Naturally investments benefiting the company are often given much greater consideration.

ThugNatty


quality posts: 1 Private Messages ThugNatty

So it sounds like short of Woot discovering that Anvil has begun dying their shirts in asbestos and DEET, this is how it's going to be. Their working standards are certainly ambiguous enough as to be reasonably ignored.

But I don't know. The owner of AA sounds like a real ass, no doubt about it. But even a blind pig finds an acorn every so often, and it sounds like they take care of their employees beyond what's expected of any modern day manufacturer (although admittedly we do set the bar pretty low).

ThugNatty


quality posts: 1 Private Messages ThugNatty
adamselby wrote:Today's Woot shirt is the first shirt I've wanted to buy that isn't on AA. I guess that's just proof the end is coming for my Woot shirt love.. The price increase I can totally bear, I'd even be willing to pay $14 per shirt for AA blanks, assuming that artist compensation went up a little bit. Bump the price on the reckoning to $18, and I'm sure Woot would still be making great money.

I hope there's another change soon in the future.



Or, shoot... Adamselby's got it. Go all Starbucks on us -- let us pay more for a higher quality product. Unless the printing methods differ so greatly between blanks, why not just order lower volume from AA while still buying bulk from Anvil? Or are you doing that... someone mentioned v-necks and something or other. I don't know. I'm tired.