Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Gah, you mean I'll be about 50 when they finally start this tour? Damn you interplanetary bunniesssss.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I was wondering how long we had to wait for the first bunny/penguin shirt. Is anyone else getting sick of the same old recycled subject matter?

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I'll be 40 :p

And ready to rock?

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Oh, Ramy. Just when I've given it to hate you, you make bunnies. And totally redeem yourself! Love it, love the navy (thank you for not using asphalt). I can't quite make out all of the text. Can you post a larger detail, please?

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Wouldn't this make at least a little bit of sense if it said galaxy tour instead of world tour?

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I actually do like a cute shirt, the cuter the better, but man, the sweetness is this one is SO high. I don't know... I might have reached my limit here. Little bunnies, AND they're purple AND they're playing guitars, AND they have little outfits on.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Oh, barf.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Silly bunnies. Space is for astronauts! And maybe cosmonauts.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I wouldn't buy this for me - it's a little too cutesy. I also can't buy it for my school-age kids because of the floating dead bunny who took a meteor to the face.

arwerther wrote:I was wondering how long we had to wait for the first bunny/penguin shirt. Is anyone else getting sick of the same old recycled subject matter?

yes.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Mmm...Mmm... rabbit stew!

Ha, very cute, love the colors.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Y halo thar pickachu

mitchellp wrote:Mmm...Mmm... rabbit stew!

Trust me, it really does taste like chicken....only not quite as good.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

This is to cute, GMV and my purchase for sure!

re: interplanetary bunnies

this guy is a one trick pony.

im tired of seeing his Kazaam (1996) up in the top and getting printed over the obviously better submissions just because of his name.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

If this is supposed to be a joke, its not even funny. I have never posted before, but I just cannot sit back and say nothing when I see this type of entry. It is an unorigional, overly used, and poorly drawn entry. Sorry to be so blunt.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Holy Kazaam (1996), mrwednesday is right. These things look identical to Pikachu.

Not to mention the band name is pretty infatuated..

Cute. But that is no longer a compliment. I hope this thing is rejected because of the Pikachu resemblance. That thing floating in the back, dead... that ain't no damn bunny.

Seriously???

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

ugh.

Looking at this shirt makes me want to fall asleep, for god sakes give me a flipping rock'in shirt.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

This is chocolatey.

Stuntdummy wrote:This is chocolatey.

Seriously woot? You changed the word L.a-m.e to chocolatey?

This shirt doesn't make me think "fake band" at all.

flibbityjibbet wrote:Holy Kazaam (1996), mrwednesday is right. These things look identical to Pikachu.

Not to mention the band name is pretty infatuated..

Cute. But that is no longer a compliment. I hope this thing is rejected because of the Pikachu resemblance. That thing floating in the back, dead... that ain't no damn bunny.

After last derby, I doubt there will be a rejection...

On another note, the band name just doesn't have a ring to it... idk maybe I'm just not for the whole cutesy thing, but when I hear "interplanetary bunnies" a piece of my soul dies a little bit. I know this is a derby for fake band names, but who in there right mind would make a band called the interplanetary bunnies? Even as a joke? When I think of fake band names, I think of something creative and witty/funny. The colors are ok, but this, in my opinion, is by no means creative. We've seen it too much!

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

8-bit/Electro-pop band right there.

Jesus people take a ride on the Whambulence already.

If it were not for the dead one floating in the back I'd vote for it, but oh well. Other than that I like it. And yes they look like bunnies to me.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

This is simply amazing. I hope it makes it into the fog.

Ya know, at first I was like, "What the hell!? Not this bullsh*t again!" But then I saw the dead bunny and I was like, "Not bad... not bad." Still, I agree with domi that the name interplanetary bunnies just isn't creative or witty enough. It just doesn't fit what this derby theme is going for.

phoenix713 wrote:This is simply amazing. I hope it makes it into the fog.

It will probably be fogged overnight.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I just voted for 20 entries that aren't this entry.

cleverconveyence wrote:I just voted for 20 entries that aren't this entry.

But if everyone else is right, you'd need at least 20 or so votes on a SINGLE entry to stop this one...

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I love this one!!!!!!!! GMV and purchase if it gets printed. i love the bunnies. i love space! i think the name is hilarious! ignore the nay-sayers. i like this shirt!

HeartlineTwist wrote:But if everyone else is right, you'd need at least 20 or so votes on a SINGLE entry to stop this one...

Or 5 people with twenty accounts each...

woemcat wrote:I love this one!!!!!!!! GMV and purchase if it gets printed. i love the bunnies. i love space! i think the name is hilarious! ignore the nay-sayers. i like this shirt!

How is the name hilarious? It's like calling the band "Three Rabbits Floating in Space". Let's be creative.

I can think of a better band name. Threekachu. *shrugs*

Sorry but that's motherflippin' Pikachu.

And if we're nitpicking.. the ear holes in the helmets should have killed the other two, as well. And the dead one doesn't have an instrument. Not even a mic. *second shrug*

Just some carelessness. I don't care who drew this, it would be hated by me.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

This entry gives me gas. When you saw that the next derby was "fake band t-shirts" is this what you thought of? You can't be serious. This is even worse than deadfrog's joke entry for this derby. Are you out of good ideas or something?

icemonster wrote:This entry gives me gas. When you saw that the next derby was "fake band t-shirts" is this what you thought of? You can't be serious. This is even worse than deadfrog's joke entry for this derby. Are you out of good ideas or something?

You have to have a good idea to be out of them.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

You're... you're not even trying, huh?

Pander, pander, pander. DeadFrog's pander-bait, at least, I find amusing because it's self-aware and actually has meaning beyond the ostensible woot self-reference. I'd buy it for the irony and wear it for the popular music commentary.

This? No. Nothing.

Even my tween cousin, who loves the majority of your and your girlfriend's work (sigh, tweens!), looked at this and didn't get or like it. She asked "are those supposed to be bunnies," and "why does the one thing have to be dead?"

Indeed, since it's a "band" "design," and they're "supposed to be" "rocking" "bunnies" (I'm very skeptical).... why does the one thing have to be dead? What does it actually contribute to the "bunny" band design?

And a question of my own: why do the "bunnies" have bodies seemingly composed of lumpy sacks of sand?

goldenthorn wrote:
Even my tween cousin, who loves the majority of you and your girlfriend's work (sigh, tweens!), looked at this and didn't get or like it. She asked "are those supposed to be bunnies," and "why does the one thing have to be dead?"

hoho. I love that your cousin asked about the dead one. Personally, that's what I like about this shirt. I'm not one for cute... unless it is slightly disturbing. (You Guys Have to Try This?)

That being said, this shirt is still a bit too cute for my taste. I would have to see a meteor actually bouncing off of the helmet or something so that the juxtaposition is a bit stronger. Also, the name would have to be something a bit more catchy/clever. (I understand that's not the artist's style, and my tastes aren't the same as the masses', however) I do still like that this is a bit different from the norm; though be it ever so slightly. Just my two cents.

BTW, I just want to point out that those are in fact bunnies... and pikachu-esque. I thought that everyone knew that by the year 2030 (2 years before this band started to make it big), the rights to bunnies had been purchased by Nintendo (a large gaming company for those who are unfamiliar). Bunnies were then genetically engineered in order to create the first reality based pokemon game... the game was unfortunately a flop due to lawsuits from PETA.

P.S. I would've caught them all.

theinfinityloop wrote:Wouldn't this make at least a little bit of sense if it said galaxy tour instead of world tour?

I was just looking at that too. I was thinking that "worlds tour" would be kinda funny.

goldenthorn wrote:You're... you're not even trying, huh?

Pander, pander, pander. DeadFrog's pander-bait, at least, I find amusing because it's self-aware and actually has meaning beyond the ostensible woot self-reference.

Eh, I'm going to have to disagree there. A lot of folks are asking "why the dead bunny?", and I think Ramy did it for reasons similar to DeadFrog's panda thing. I can't even count the number of times I've heard wooters complaining about Ramy's style (which I also don't care for) and wishing those ridiculous beady eyed chibi animals would all just die and stop plaguing the site (internet/earth/galaxy). I think this is what Ramy did here, sort of poking fun at himself, and it's what makes the shirt considerable of a vote, in my opinion.

I don't think he is taking this entry *completely* seriously, and it's showing in vote totals. He's not SOARING at the top of the fog like he usually does, and I don't think he was expecting to.

I'd be more likely to vote for Ramy because I see this entry as something to make the rest of us sort of giggle. Deadfrog's just feels like a slap in the face. A very distressed, bad type choice slap in the face. I can giggle that he's being so vengeful, but I'd never encourage him to do it again or promise that I'd buy one.




*stretch* what a way to start the morning. Anyone want a bagel?

bellarific wrote:
I'd be more likely to vote for Ramy because I see this entry as something to make the rest of us sort of giggle. Deadfrog's just feels like a slap in the face. A very distressed, bad type choice slap in the face. I can giggle that he's being so vengeful, but I'd never encourage him to do it again or promise that I'd buy one.

*stretch* what a way to start the morning. Anyone want a bagel?

Oh, dear. I see it as the exact opposite situation, with ramyb as you described DeadFrog, and DeadFrog as you described ramyb. Opinions, eh?

I want a bagel! But I only have plain in the house, and I want a mish mosh. With chive cream cheese and lox. Alas, my car is in the shop and it's too humid to walk. Be a dear and bring me some?

bellarific wrote:Eh, I'm going to have to disagree there. A lot of folks are asking "why the dead bunny?", and I think Ramy did it for reasons similar to DeadFrog's panda thing. I can't even count the number of times I've heard wooters complaining about Ramy's style (which I also don't care for) and wishing those ridiculous beady eyed chibi animals would all just die and stop plaguing the site (internet/earth/galaxy). I think this is what Ramy did here, sort of poking fun at himself, and it's what makes the shirt considerable of a vote, in my opinion.

I don't think he is taking this entry *completely* seriously, and it's showing in vote totals. He's not SOARING at the top of the fog like he usually does, and I don't think he was expecting to.

I'd be more likely to vote for Ramy because I see this entry as something to make the rest of us sort of giggle. Deadfrog's just feels like a slap in the face. A very distressed, bad type choice slap in the face. I can giggle that he's being so vengeful, but I'd never encourage him to do it again or promise that I'd buy one.




*stretch* what a way to start the morning. Anyone want a bagel?

You are giving way too much credit where none is due. There is absolutely nothing about this entry that hasn't been created by a million other chibi artists and quite frankly the cutesy dead ones are just as common as the cutesy shiny live ones. It's all completely rehashed.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Would have been better if the chibi animal in the background was a dead horse.

flibbityjibbet wrote:How is the name hilarious? It's like calling the band "Three Rabbits Floating in Space". Let's be creative.

I can think of a better band name. Threekachu. *shrugs*

Sorry but that's motherflippin' Pikachu.

And if we're nitpicking.. the ear holes in the helmets should have killed the other two, as well. And the dead one doesn't have an instrument. Not even a mic. *second shrug*

Just some carelessness. I don't care who drew this, it would be hated by me.

the name just struck a funny chord with me. i don't know why. i just like the name. i happen to like the shirt. different strokes for different folks. there are plenty of shirts on shirt woot that i don't particularly care for and others that i really like. this one happens to be in the latter category for me.

i like bunnies. and the more different while maintaining their cute, resonate with me (like i love the bunny on monty python's quest for the holy grail---cute but really evil).

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

not too fond of the "too cute" variety myself, just not my cup of tea.

wouldn't have commented except that having read the discussion, i couldn't help but mention that as i was looking at the design, my 12-year old son peeked over my shoulder and commented, "That's Pikachu dressed up like bunnies....."

goldenthorn wrote:Oh, dear. I see it as the exact opposite situation, with ramyb as you described DeadFrog, and DeadFrog as you described ramyb. Opinions, eh?

I want a bagel! But I only have plain in the house, and I want a mish mosh. With chive cream cheese and lox. Alas, my car is in the shop and it's too humid to walk. Be a dear and bring me some?

I totally would, but I have a sneaking suspicion that you're a little too far away for either of us to make a trip to the other over a bagel. Plus, it's just about dinner time. :P

mrwednesday wrote:You are giving way too much credit where none is due. There is absolutely nothing about this entry that hasn't been created by a million other chibi artists and quite frankly the cutesy dead ones are just as common as the cutesy shiny live ones. It's all completely rehashed.

I guess I'm not familiar enough with this style to know that's a rehashed idea. Ahh well. What can ya do?

cinmarrn wrote:...wouldn't have commented except that having read the discussion, i couldn't help but mention that as i was looking at the design, my 12-year old son peeked over my shoulder and commented, "That's Pikachu dressed up like bunnies....."

No offense, but, as I explained earlier, this isn't the original pikachu... your son obviously doesn't know a futuristic, genetically engineered, super bunny with lighting powers when he sees one.

I wish you sheeple would quit voting for artists... This is not a first place band T-shirt.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

The one on the left:

The one on the right:

cruelnv wrote:No offense, but, as I explained earlier, this isn't the original pikachu... your son obviously doesn't know a futuristic, genetically engineered, super bunny with lighting powers when he sees one.

You are not funny nor adding anything to this discussion.
All I will add is that, once again, Ramyb has thrown together another cutesy design that looks like all his other cutesy designs and it is racing to the top.

When will it end????? Personally, I blame Woot for starting to offer children's sizes. That was when the downfall of the Derby and IMHO the quality of shirts offered as dailies started and the cute began.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

My daughter love space AND bunnies. Who doesn't? She wouldn't let me NOT buy one.

I'd really like to see better type treatment in this derby. This shirt only one example of many with fonts that don't fit the image and set the type in very un-interesting way.

spanishmel wrote:I'd really like to see better type treatment in this derby. This shirt only one example of many with fonts that don't fit the image and set the type in very un-interesting way.

You are asking FAR TOO MUCH from this submitter.

cmdixon2 wrote:My daughter love space AND bunnies. Who doesn't? She wouldn't let me NOT buy one.

Awww. Though, even though one of the bunnies is... well... not doing so well?

snarkygal wrote:
When will it end????? Personally, I blame Woot for starting to offer children's sizes. That was when the downfall of the Derby and IMHO the quality of shirts offered as dailies started and the cute began.

I know, those darn kids. :@ How DARE they want to wear clothes! Everyone knows they should just be stuck in rags and sacks till they're old enough to wear big people clothes!

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Fogged? Ugh.

People sure do like to complain a lot around here. If you don't like it, don't vote for it. Pretty simple imo. There are plenty of winners that I hated the design for, but that's my personal taste. Who is anybody here to judge others personal taste? Nobody is making you buy a shirt that you don't like if it wins, are they? Welcome to democracy people. I may just vote for this one just to spite people who purposely vote for others to prevent this design from winning. I don't like the dead bunny at all, but I don't like people being vindictive more, just because they don't like something. Constructive criticism is one thing, being douchey is another.

Beffy wrote:I know, those darn kids. :@ How DARE they want to wear clothes! Everyone knows they should just be stuck in rags and sacks till they're old enough to wear big people clothes!

I think the point is why should parents be shopping for clothes at what seemed to be a niche site like Woot anyway? There's a billion other retail outlets in the physical world and a ton more online that scream kid friendly before Shirt.Woot does/did.

That said, the ratio of "cute" to "non-cute" in the reckoning makes me feel slightly better about it all.

Not good enough to think that this design is anywhere near approaching an objectively good band shirt design.

Yes, differences in tastes and all of that jazz, but there's a LARGE difference between having a recognizable, popular style and never trying to mix it up in a meaningful way. Yes, Ramy and Seki have done it, but their back up styles have all been stylistically similar to each other as well.

Whereas there are plenty of other designers that always try to bring new things to the table with each design, even if you can pick their designs out of the Derby.

mikenytola wrote:People sure do like to complain a lot around here. If you don't like it, don't vote for it. Pretty simple imo. There are plenty of winners that I hated the design for, but that's my personal taste. Who is anybody here to judge others personal taste? Nobody is making you buy a shirt that you don't like if it wins, are they? Welcome to democracy people. I may just vote for this one just to spite people who purposely vote for others to prevent this design from winning. I don't like the dead bunny at all, but I don't like people being vindictive more, just because they don't like something. Constructive criticism is one thing, being douchey is another.

I'm pretty sure the people who are complaining about this particular design aren't voting for it, so I'm not sure why anyone would even say that. You're right about one thing; no one forces the people who don't like the designs to buy them, but that's not why they complain. It's because a lot of people want to see something original and creative. The people who are complaining are sick and tired of seeing cutesy animals and reused ideas. How is this original? Whether the artist meant to or not... it's Pikachu! And the title, imho, is just chocolatey. The whole "world tour" as opposed to "worlds" or "galaxy" or something more fitting with the whole direction of the shirt shows that it was clearly overlooked by the artist. Personally, as I read through the comments, I don't think anyone was being particularly "douchey" and even if they were... if an artist can't handle criticism (constructive or not) than he or she shouldn't be an artist!

On another note, voting for this to get back at the people you think are being mean is the dumbest reason to vote for something. You said yourself, if you don't like it... why would you vote for it? Vote for someone who deserves it.

mikenytola wrote:People sure do like to complain a lot around here. If you don't like it, don't vote for it. Pretty simple imo. There are plenty of winners that I hated the design for, but that's my personal taste. Who is anybody here to judge others personal taste? Nobody is making you buy a shirt that you don't like if it wins, are they? Welcome to democracy people. I may just vote for this one just to spite people who purposely vote for others to prevent this design from winning. I don't like the dead bunny at all, but I don't like people being vindictive more, just because they don't like something. Constructive criticism is one thing, being douchey is another.

So now you're whining about people whining? Way to rise above.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

You guys can't be serious...you put this IN THE FOG?!?!?!
This is by far the worst Ramyb shirt ever, and you losers have once again, clicked the "I'd want one" button...disgusting.
The "band" name doesn't sound like one at all.
The bunnies look like pikachu.
This does not look like a "fake band t-shirt" people!!! It looks like ramyb took a stock drawing of his and gave them instruments and put "world tour" on the shirt and called it good.
The logistics of cheating/hacking to get more votes with multiple accounts seems far fetched to me, but I sure have a hard time believing that so many people actually like this filth.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I don't have kids and therefore have zero reason to buy this. But, if I did have kids, and if it were good enough to the point that I'd buy it for them, I NEVER WOULD BECAUSE I CAN'T STAND THOSE #&!@&%# EYES!

If you're going to do cute, at least do cute with normal eyes. Please. Seriously.

snarkygal wrote:You are not funny nor adding anything to this discussion.
All I will add is that, once again, Ramyb has thrown together another cutesy design that looks like all his other cutesy designs and it is racing to the top.

When will it end????? Personally, I blame Woot for starting to offer children's sizes. That was when the downfall of the Derby and IMHO the quality of shirts offered as dailies started and the cute began.

I apologize for my lack of humor (it is something that I was born with). I was simply trying to lighten the mood a bit. I don't know if you've noticed or not, but there are a lot of people who seem to take things a bit too seriously around here.

Personally, I feel that trying to diminish a bit of the hostility in the discussion actually adds more than complaining about the way that previous changes have horrendously affected designs, but apparently others feel differently. Thank you for your valued insight on the matter.

domi123 wrote:It's because a lot of people want to see something original and creative.

Well then they should get busy making something original and creative then, shouldn't they? Or... don't buy the shirts that win! Ah yes, freedom of choice. Part of that whole democracy bit.

If they are so tired of cutesy things winning then that's just too bad isn't it? There are many designs that win that I personally think are not original or creative, but again that is my opinion. If the majority of people like it, too bad for me and good for that designer. Again, if people want something more original and creative then they can go ahead and do it themselves, or just leave because they will never be satisfied. Or they can stick around and never be satisfied or happy. Once again, good ole democracy. The freedom to chose your own misery!

And I said I *might vote for it just to spite the complainers, doesn't mean I will. I did say I don't like the dead bunny. ;)

mikenytola wrote:Well then they should get busy making something original and creative then, shouldn't they?

When you leave the movie theater after having watched something terrible (for the sake of argument, let's say anything by Michael Bay), would you be annoyed if someone attacked your criticism of said terrible movie with "well, how about YOU try making a better film, mister critic?"

If the analogy is too far off for your taste ("I don't have $80 million to make a movie" you might very well say) then replace the idea of a terrible movie with a terrible book.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Aaaand woot demonstrates, once again, why I haven't bought any of their offered shirts since the alternate history derby back in JANUARY.

camoor wrote:Would have been better if the chibi animal in the background was a dead horse.

instantrimshot.com

IndependentVik wrote:When you leave the movie theater after having watched something terrible (for the sake of argument, let's say anything by Michael Bay), would you be annoyed if someone attacked your criticism of said terrible movie with "well, how about YOU try making a better film, mister critic?"

If the analogy is too far off for your taste ("I don't have $80 million to make a movie" you might very well say) then replace the idea of a terrible movie with a terrible book.

Let's use your movie analogy for a second to take a look at why people feel they have a right to complain about designs on here in the first place.

When you go to the movie, you are exchanging currency for a service (at least I think that it would be a service, I'm pretty sure it's not considered goods?). If you receive poor service, you would obviously be upset since you wouldn't feel you received what you paid for. Here you don't pay for anything... it's free... we don't do anything but give some of our time.

The second issue is that when you go to a movie, you expect it to be "good" according to the previews. If it didn't meet your expectations, I would again see reason for someone to complain. When it comes to the designs on here, people know what to expect... and they get just that. Complaining about getting exactly what is expected seems a bit silly, doesn't it? If I complained that High School Musical 3 was a childish musical after I had seen the previews, or that The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn didn't have spaceships in it after I had read the back cover, then I'd be a bit foolish wouldn't I?

The point I'm trying to make (even though I might not be doing so very well... I am quite tired), is that everyone who comes on here to complain plans on doing so before they log in. If they are trying to get people to change their habits, then that's one thing. If they continue to do so without any success, then they are just beating a dead rabbit.

While some movies may break through and actually have something great to them, Hollywood is driven by sex and violence... it may not be pleasant, but that's the way it is and will continue to be. We have to put up with horrible cookie-cutter box office smashes while we look forward to those few that really break the mold...

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

No jokes about a rabbit dying?

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

This Derby is filled with so many wearable, creative, unique and clever designs. Shirts that aren't cutesy, but are instead very entertaining. Shirts you know it took alot of thought to conceive. That being said, it sickens me that something like this is in the fog.

There are probably 15 shirts in this Derby that I'd definitely buy, and as of right now none of them are in the fog. Damn shame for a Derby that had so much potential.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

MALE

mikenytola wrote:Well then they should get busy making something original and creative then, shouldn't they? Or... don't buy the shirts that win! Ah yes, freedom of choice. Part of that whole democracy bit.

that is your standard ad hominem arguement. you are saying i have no right to complain about this design because i couldnt do better, right? so anything i say about this design, for example, the type doesnt match the illustration and the poor choice of words (world tour) is immediately invalid because i havent made a more popular design? just because i dont design t shirts doesnt mean i dont have logic and taste. by your logic, no one should complain about politicians because "if they could do better, why didnt they just run for office" meanwhile we have to put up with a president who tinkles away money on a needless war, strips the people of their rights through the patriot act, hides everything he does under the heading "state secret" and spends about a third of his time on vacation.

freedom of choice, part of that whole democracy thing...

you know what else is part of democracy

FREEDOM OF SPEECH!

[MOD: You were doing ok until that last sentence which I deleted]

marmls2m wrote:meanwhile we have to put up with a president who tinkles away money on a needless war, strips the people of their rights through the patriot act, hides everything he does under the heading "state secret" and spends about a third of his time on vacation.

I'm not wholly disagreeing with you but his replacement hasn't been much better imo.

marmls2m wrote:

freedom of choice, part of that whole democracy thing...

you know what else is part of democracy

FREEDOM OF SPEECH!

[MOD: You were doing ok until that last sentence which I deleted]

We do have freedom of speech, but this is also a privately owned site. We have no actual rights to post anything on here. So, technically speaking, anything we write can be removed whether we consider it "fair" or not.

As far as your point that you should be able to make critiques on someone's work without being told "Let's see you do better," I agree with you... to some extent. Artists should be able to handle criticism in order to better hone their skills... but there is a difference between constructive criticism and criticism for the sake of being spiteful (I'm not targeting you here, just simply talking about this debate in general).

As I said earlier (when talking about the movie analogy above), most people seem to come on here and have an intent to leave feedback that doesn't actually help anyone and simply causes distress. Not only is there no "right" (legally speaking) to leave these comments, but they are often unwelcome as well.

I'm all for criticism... I just question intent.

marmls2m wrote:...

freedom of choice, part of that whole democracy thing...

you know what else is part of democracy

FREEDOM OF SPEECH!

[MOD: You were doing ok until that last sentence which I deleted]

That is right you have freedom of speech to complain. Just like you have the freedom to ignore that I said constructive criticism is one thing, complaining is another. So if you were being constructive why do you seem to be taking it so personal? Or did you want to just be argumentative? Let's use your example now

" by your logic, no one should complain about politicians because "if they could do better, why didnt they just run for office"

You are right, people should complain because that is going to solve the problem isn't it? Do you think opposing politicians complain... or do something about it and also run for office? Complaining about the problem doesn't solve anything. Actions speak louder than words. Yes you have freedom of speech, doesn't mean you know how to use it in the right and/or positive way.

And for the record, I'm not complaining, I"m just calling them out and exposing them for what they are. At the end of the day, if this shirt wins... good for the designer, if it doesn't, good for the designer's that did win. Majority wins. I'm fine either way, yet the complainers will be ready for the next derby to complain some more. Get your canned comments ready!

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Thank god this is out of the fog right now.

re: interplanetary bunnies

When a Pokemon is spent it gets the X's over its eyes.

And this image is dead on Pikachu, especially the dead one with the X'd eyes.

Why hasn't Woot rejected this design?

mikenytola wrote:
You are right, people should complain because that is going to solve the problem isn't it? Do you think opposing politicians complain... or do something about it and also run for office? Complaining about the problem doesn't solve anything. Actions speak louder than words. Yes you have freedom of speech, doesn't mean you know how to use it in the right and/or positive way.

first and foremost, apologies to the mod, i will reel it in a bit

the reason i take it personally is that if no one points out your flawed logic, some will not know better to disregard your arguement as being built on flawed logic.

now, you say complaining about the problem doesnt solve anything in regards to politics. but you are wrong. complaining draws attention to the problem and attention turns to action. to use an idiom "the squeaky wheel gets the oil". take for example the current fight in this country for marraige equality. without protesting, several states (though notably not california) have overturned their laws and allows marraige for everyone, regardless of discrimination.

and what is protest if not organized complaining? are you saying that the people in iran right now are accomplishing nothing and that those people are dying in the streets for nothing?

i will grant you that last statement could be seen as fallacious appeal to emotion, but take the emotion out of it. they have brought the worlds attention to the injustices in their country and we will see in the coming weeks what the result of that will be. it all started from complaining. which is, according to our constitution, our god given right.

you are tired of complaining. that is your real issue, is it not? you feel we should stop complaining because you personally or a few people here dont want to read it. but i, as a chronic complainer, do want to hear it. are your wishes more righteous than mine, or the people here who complain, as youve labeled them?

mikenytola wrote: Majority wins. I'm fine either way, yet the complainers will be ready for the next derby to complain some more. Get your canned comments ready!

going with the majority is a very dangerous sentiment. dissent refines and shapes the status quo. dissent changes things, not complacency. nothing changes if everyone goes with the flow

mikenytola wrote:Well then they should get busy making something original and creative then, shouldn't they? Or... don't buy the shirts that win! Ah yes, freedom of choice. Part of that whole democracy bit.

By this logic, no one is allowed to have an opinion (positive or negative, can't pick and choose here) on any art form unless they are artists of that specific form.

I don't like complaining at all, personally, but really, what's the harm in conflicting opinions? Why try to shut people up?

spanishmel wrote:I'd really like to see better type treatment in this derby. This shirt only one example of many with fonts that don't fit the image and set the type in very un-interesting way.

Agreed. I think that typefaces can make or break most of the designs in the derby. Too bad some people didn't take advantage of the power and fun of typography.

kmcavin65 wrote:No jokes about a rabbit dying?

The shirt isn't enough of a joke for you?

marmls2m wrote:
now, you say complaining about the problem doesnt solve anything in regards to politics. but you are wrong. complaining draws attention to the problem and attention turns to action. to use an idiom "the squeaky wheel gets the oil". take for example the current fight in this country for marraige equality. without protesting, several states (though notably not california) have overturned their laws and allows marraige for everyone, regardless of discrimination.

and what is protest if not organized complaining? are you saying that the people in iran right now are accomplishing nothing and that those people are dying in the streets for nothing?

i will grant you that last statement could be seen as fallacious appeal to emotion, but take the emotion out of it. they have brought the worlds attention to the injustices in their country and we will see in the coming weeks what the result of that will be. it all started from complaining. which is, according to our constitution, our god given right.

I'll just agree with you since you have it all figured out. Everybody keep on complaining, it's going to change other peoples opinions to conform to yours. It's not even worth pointing out the flaws in your last post. You are obviously a blaring liberal as well, so no use having a conversation with you anymore. We will have to agree to disagree.

marmls2m wrote:going with the majority is a very dangerous sentiment. dissent refines and shapes the status quo. dissent changes things, not complacency. nothing changes if everyone goes with the flow

*hugs marmls2m*

You're cool.

mikenytola wrote:I'll just agree with you since you have it all figured out. Everybody keep on complaining, it's going to change other peoples opinions to conform to yours. It's not even worth pointing out the flaws in your last post. [/b]You are obviously a blaring liberal as well[/b], so no use having a conversation with you anymore. We will have to agree to disagree.

As if this is even the slightest bit germane to the discussion!

pssquishy wrote:As if this is even the slightest bit germane to the discussion!

According to MySpace this is already a band :

http://www.myspace.com/theinterplanetarybunnies

GigliWasAGoodMovie wrote:According to MySpace this is already a band :

http://www.myspace.com/theinterplanetarybunnies

The Interplanetary Bunnies: General Info

Member Since 6/28/2009

Whether or not you like the shirt, no fair creating a band after the shirt was created.

GigliWasAGoodMovie wrote:According to MySpace this is already a band :

http://www.myspace.com/theinterplanetarybunnies

Oh, great. When it was brought up in the derby thread, I figured someone would try it.

Member Since: 28/06/2009

Whether the entry is a terrible design or not, this is still a real jerk move.

Edit: I see someone beat me to the punch. But hey, I guess it's worth repeating.

marmls2m wrote:going with the majority is a very dangerous sentiment. dissent refines and shapes the status quo. dissent changes things, not complacency. nothing changes if everyone goes with the flow

I didn't say going with the majority did I? I just said majority wins. Which is completely true here. Whoever has the highest amount of votes wins and they have the majority of voters. Right? Are you only reading what you want to see? You are now opposing me about things I didn't even say. ;)

eHalcyon wrote: Whether the entry is a terrible design or not, this is still a real jerk move.

I kind of like it. It's spunky.

mikenytola wrote:You are obviously a blaring liberal as well, so no use having a conversation with you anymore

You tell 'em. Darned liberals! Their hippie ideology makes them unable to view the online t-shirt world properly.

Seriously, what?

mikenytola wrote:I didn't say going with the majority did I? I just said majority wins. Which is completely true here. Whoever has the highest amount of votes wins and they have the majority of voters. Right? Are you only reading what you want to see? You are now opposing me about things I didn't even say. ;)

I believe what is being said on the opposite side is that that sort of merit basis is dangerous. Whether it is true or not, it shouldn't be.

IndependentVik wrote:You tell 'em. Darned liberals! Their hippie ideology makes them unable to view the online t-shirt world properly.

Seriously, what?

I know you are kidding, but I always thought most of the masters, of any art form, were of more liberal bent.

IndependentVik wrote:You tell 'em. Darned liberals! Their hippie ideology makes them unable to view the online t-shirt world properly.

Seriously, what?

If you can't see the connection there is nothing I can do to help you. Go back and try reading everything this time, or are you too busy in other woot entries complaining about them as well to actually pay attention?

Here I am promoting that people use constructive criticism instead of b!tching and complaining, and I seem to have hit a nerve in some people and am greeting with resistance. Funny how you can dish it out but can't take my criticisms of your attitude. hoho

AdderXYU wrote:I know you are kidding, but I always thought most of the masters, of any art form, were of more liberal bent.

He/she was replying to an earlier comment that accused someone of being a liberal for no apparent reason. Damn right-wing bastards.

AdderXYU wrote:I believe what is being said on the opposite side is that that sort of merit basis is dangerous. Whether it is true or not, it shouldn't be.

I agree with the statement that was made, he/she was just being argumentative for arguments sake. Hell, Bush was the majority vote and look how that turned out, and I sure as hell didn't vote for him either time.

And I'm not a conservative pssquishy, but nice try. Not my fault you best. thing. ever. to see the connection to the liberal statement. Not surprised. ;)

mikenytola wrote:If you can't see the connection there is nothing I can do to help you.

You're right, there's nothing you can do to make me see your insanity. Completely my fault for even trying. Carry on.

IndependentVik wrote:You're right, there's nothing you can do to make me see your insanity. Completely my fault for even trying. Carry on.

Well apparently I'm insane, but at least I'm literate and can read and put two and two together. So what does that make you? You are right, don't bother trying, get back to the complaining you do so well.

Oh and here's a hint about the liberal statement... go back and try reading everything, I know it's hard for the illiterate, but give a shot, you might learn something.

mikenytola wrote:I agree with the statement that was made, he/she was just being argumentative for arguments sake. Hell, Bush was the majority vote and look how that turned out, and I sure as hell didn't vote for him either time.

He wasn't the majority vote the first time, as I recall, and won purely on a questionable recount in Florida putting him ahead in the electoral college.

Though the scenario does hammer home just how bad the majority tends to be at picking things. Hell, I still think Obama's "popular vote" margin was tooooo thin for any card with Sarah Palin on it.

Riddle me this.

Why have the three horsemen in this tread who are all worked up over me calling you out, not complaining in the panda woot that is in the fog? It's the SAME panda as before, SAME color shirt SAME scratchy texture, and it's a CUTE animal slightly adjusted to this weeks theme. I mean come on, if you are going to make the effort to complain about a design at least be consistent. Like someone else stated, your intentions are questionable. k thx

mikenytola wrote:Well apparently I'm insane, but at least I'm literate and can read and put two and two together. So what does that make you? You are right, don't bother trying, get back to the complaining you do so well.

Oh and here's a hint about the liberal statement... go back and try reading everything, I know it's hard for the illiterate, but give a shot, you might learn something.

I love how you keep typing the same thing over and over, like it makes what you have to say any less false.

The poster you were originally arguing with _was_ making some political points; however, and I'm _certain_ this is probably over your head, the ideological bent his comments were taking had absolutely no relevance to the actual argument you two were having about the nature of majorities. That is, he could've taken a more conservative angle to make his points and that wouldn't have made his arguments any more, or less, correct. Truth be told, he derailed the conversation somewhat by venturing into politics. The fact that you attacked his ideology as somehow invalidating his entire premise means that you only derailed it further.

Oh, and try counting how many designs I've complained about this derby (one) versus how many I've praised (many). But, then, you looove jumping to conclusions, don't you? For one, I'm more of an independent than anything else (check out my screen name, doofus).

The fact is, I would've called you out on insulting his ideology no matter what its bent was, b/c it was completely irrelevant to tearing down his basic premise.

Mikenytola is right. Majority wins. Especially here. Some people want creative T-shirts. That is their reason to vote. Some people want to buy just cute and funny T-shirt that’s why they vote on for instance cute and funny bunny ones. Many people want creative and original T-shirts , but some of them found the cute ones creative and original and they might found other people favorite ones boring or less creative. Everybody is different. There are lots of cute animal designed T-shirt and only few of them won. Probably there is reason. Maybe they are creative and funny, just not for everybody. We need to tolerate everybody’s taste and desire and let the best to win.
Everybody should just calm down and relax and stop attacking each other. This should be a fun site for all of us.

IndependentVik wrote:I love how you keep typing the same thing over and over, like it makes what you have to say any less false.

I love how you continue to not read things correctly. I wouldn't have to repeat myself so much. I did not insult his ideology, I just stated that he was a blaring liberal and there no use having a conversation with them anymore. If you take that as insulting then that is your problem not mine. Nor was my "actual" argument with that personal about the nature of majorities. Nor were my original statements directed to you being a person doing nothing but complaining. You seem to be taking it so personally. Who is jumping to conclusions here? Nor did I even hint that you were a liberal either "doofus", which goes back to my point that you have having a hard time comprehending what is written or are just not reading it. You can call me out for calling certain people douchey if you want, that one could apply to some people.

mikenytola wrote:I love how you continue to not read things correctly. I wouldn't have to repeat myself so much. I did not insult his ideology, I just stated that he was a blaring liberal and there no use having a conversation with them anymore. If you take that as insulting then that is your problem not mine. Nor was my "actual" argument with that personal about the nature of majorities. Nor were my original statements directed to you being a person doing nothing but complaining. You seem to be taking it so personally. Who is jumping to conclusions here? Nor did I even hint that you were a liberal either "doofus", which goes back to my point that you have having a hard time comprehending what is written or are just not reading it. You can call me out for calling certain people douchey if you want, that one could apply to some people.

The way you said "blaring liberal" made it seem like an insult.

I'm going to try not to get any more involved in this argument, but I'd like to say that Vik is one of the most reasonable, level-headed guys in the shirt.woot forums.

That is all.

eHalcyon wrote:The way you said "blaring liberal" made it seem like an insult.

I'm going to try not to get any more involved in this argument, but I'd like to say that Vik is one of the most reasonable, level-headed guys in the shirt.woot forums.

That is all.

What are you saying about the rest of us? Huh? Huh?

pssquishy wrote:What are you saying about the rest of us? Huh? Huh?

You're all a bunch of jerky jerkfaced jerks! NYAH.

mikenytola wrote:I did not insult his ideology, I just stated that he was a blaring liberal and there no use having a conversation with them anymore.

And how, exactly, is that not insulting his ideology? You call someone a blaring anything and that's an implied insult. If you weren't such a blaring illiterate, maybe you'd realize that.

edit: As well, saying that someone is a ____ and therefore there's no use talking to them is an insult against whatever ____ happens to be.

Ugh. Seriously?

This is a fake band on a fake TV show geared for fake children and is broadcasting on a fake TV station, again with a fake target audience of fake children.

I don't take issue with the designer. I just shake my head in disbelief at those who voted it into the fog. And I will shake my head in disbelief when I see you walking down the street wearing this fake band shirt.

mikenytola wrote: blah blah blah mikenytola is trying to insult people's literacy, points of argument and opinions while himself lacking even a basic understanding of (or willingness to employ) grammar or logical argumentation blah blah blah

No

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

There are some really good fake band shirts in this derby - unfortunately, this is not one of those shirts...

oh please god dont let this win. Just becasue its "cute" doesnt mean its good. In fact that usually makes makes it worse

bunnyfairy wrote:Mikenytola is right. Majority wins. Especially here. Some people want creative T-shirts. That is their reason to vote. Some people want to buy just cute and funny T-shirt that’s why they vote on for instance cute and funny bunny ones. Many people want creative and original T-shirts , but some of them found the cute ones creative and original and they might found other people favorite ones boring or less creative. Everybody is different. There are lots of cute animal designed T-shirt and only few of them won. Probably there is reason. Maybe they are creative and funny, just not for everybody. We need to tolerate everybody’s taste and desire and let the best to win.
Everybody should just calm down and relax and stop attacking each other. This should be a fun site for all of us.

I largely agree with you except that I think the issue people had with Mikentyola is that he wasn't being tolerant of people's taste, and complaining about people complaining.

However, it's more than possible to voice dislike for a design without being unnecessarily negative. Likewise, it's best to not try to say "how dare you hold that opinion?!" It works for both sides; it's equally chocolatey to attack people for liking a design.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

Good concept. GMV.

mikenytola wrote:I didn't say going with the majority did I? I just said majority wins. Which is completely true here. Whoever has the highest amount of votes wins and they have the majority of voters. Right? Are you only reading what you want to see? You are now opposing me about things I didn't even say. ;)

isnt "go with the flow" the general idea behind your "dont complain" belief?

studio1172 wrote:Agreed. I think that typefaces can make or break most of the designs in the derby. Too bad some people didn't take advantage of the power and fun of typography.

Here here! Maybe a type derby would bring out the big guns! Anyone else?

bunnyfairy wrote:Mikenytola is right. Majority wins. Especially here. Some people want creative T-shirts. That is their reason to vote. Some people want to buy just cute and funny T-shirt that’s why they vote on for instance cute and funny bunny ones. Many people want creative and original T-shirts , but some of them found the cute ones creative and original and they might found other people favorite ones boring or less creative. Everybody is different. There are lots of cute animal designed T-shirt and only few of them won. Probably there is reason. Maybe they are creative and funny, just not for everybody. We need to tolerate everybody’s taste and desire and let the best to win.
Everybody should just calm down and relax and stop attacking each other. This should be a fun site for all of us.

and this is exactly why is it so important for us, who want change, to be so vocal with our dissension. like i said before complacency changes nothing. we cant just sit here silent expecting things to change towards our preference. so dont begrudge us our complaints. THAT is my point.

and for the record, i am not a liberal, i am an independent. i do not confine my views based on what party leaders tell me. for example, i support the death penalty and am pro-choice. i hate bad leaders regardless of political affiliation, and i equally stand for any cause i find moving

mikenytola wrote:If you can't see the connection there is nothing I can do to help you. Go back and try reading everything this time, or are you too busy in other woot entries complaining about them as well to actually pay attention?

Here I am promoting that people use constructive criticism instead of b!tching and complaining, and I seem to have hit a nerve in some people and am greeting with resistance. Funny how you can dish it out but can't take my criticisms of your attitude. hoho

funny how you would say that we cant take a criticism of our attitude when the start of this conversation came about when i pointed out your flawed logic. yet you continue to defend your flawed logic. give it up. ad hominem arguements are proven to be nothing but fallible

Mikenytola- Consider me the fourth horseman if you wish. I'm going to try to give you my point of view as an artist. You have suggested that because some criticisms aren't cushioned in nice, happy language they are therefore mute or illegitimate. This is a relatively common sentiment here on Woot. It seems to me that this sentiment is born of hurt feelings...you have insulted my work and therefore me so I'm going to discount your words by calling them harsh and wrong. By taking this point of view we run the risk of stunting our discussions to the point where the real information is lost in a sea of niceties and manners. All criticism should be welcome here, it is up to the artist to accept it or let it roll of their backs (and we have moderators to clean up). Conversely it is up to the user to express their words however they see fit. "Constructive criticism" isn't always useful criticism, I can't even count how many class-room critiques I have participated in where the only word of advice for the artist "it's cute" or "I like it". So many people keep their mouths closed in the name of "niceness" but the result is their voice isn't heard. Frankly I prefer honest and real discussions where there is a risk of things getting heated and toes might get stepped on. It is hard enough to get people to speak openly so why insist on punishing those who do? In my assessment every artist here would like the opportunity to grow and win the derby. So, aside from the fact the you have resorted to name calling, you are essentially negating the whole reason the derby exists. It is a competition but it also a community of artists and the threads are here for us to communicate. Please don't tell us to compromise the productivity of our community because you don't like harsh words. I would consider it a great loss if the dissenters disappeared and were replaced happy, nice, medicated people who offer nothing but support. Criticism in all its forms is highly valued form of support for an artists because it allows the opportunity to improve. And for the weak of heart, or those prone to nervousness or depression there is always the option not to read the threads.

spanishmel wrote:Look at the entry above.

Amen! This is one of the most well thought out posts in this thread. Please read it carefully. No one should ever be told not to voice their opinion.

orzine wrote:Amen! This is one of the most well thought out posts in this thread. Please read it carefully. No one should ever be told not to voice their opinion.

Voicing an opinion is one thing, but I think we can still do that without calling each other names. "Constructive criticism" isn't being nice and supportive of all designs - it's giving actual, useful criticism. Repeatedly insulting a design or designer is not constructive criticism and can actually be detrimental as it drowns out the real criticism - that a particular part of the design could use more work, that the colour palette is unappealing, etc. Criticism can be kindly worded or harshly delivered, but we shouldn't take the "critique" portion out of it. And unfortunately, that's what happens a lot of the time in these forums.

spanishmel wrote:"Constructive criticism" isn't always useful criticism, I can't even count how many class-room critiques I have participated in where the only word of advice for the artist "it's cute" or "I like it". So many people keep their mouths closed in the name of "niceness" but the result is their voice isn't heard. Frankly I prefer honest and real discussions where there is a risk of things getting heated and toes might get stepped on.

I agree that honest and real is the best way to give criticism most of the time. How else will someone get better? Constructive criticism is not necessarily "nice" criticism, however. The stuff you have in class isn't constructive nor is it criticism. It's just commentary. Constructive criticism can be harsh, so long as it is useful.

The problem is that there are too many people on here give criticism without the "constructive" part. That's just pointless. Someone isn't going to change their work if they are just told it embrangles. They need advice on what should change.

For instance, some people said that this design needs a better band name, doesn't look enough like a band shirt, should have a different tour name, looks too much like Pokemon, etc. This is criticism that the artist could choose to use; even if they say it in a mean way. If someone just says they hate it, then that's pretty useless for everyone.

eHalcyon wrote:Said what I was trying to but articulated it better...

Yeah, what you said, hoho.

spanishmel wrote:

My original argument which was put off course by the complainers was that constructive criticism was one thing, complaining is another. All because people were complaining WITHOUT giving constructive criticism. From there others guided the conversation into other directions.

I also never pointed out that any one person was being douchey, and that is actually describing an attitude not name calling. If I called somebody a Champion of the Sun, then sure that would be an insult, but I didn't. The only name called was when IndependentVik called me a "doofus" and thus my reply to him with the same. Did that hurt his feelings? I sure hope not. Calling somebody a blaring liberal is also not name calling, it's an observation of somebody who is loudly speaking liberal statements. Did I call anybody any other names? If I did then I stand corrected, but please point this out before accusing me of something I didn't do.

I never said that people shouldn't complain as long as they are giving constructive criticism, and people attacked me for it. Some of them were not even the subject of my statement.

Complaining that "there are too many cute shirts" and "how can people vote for this, woot should be ashamed" or "that's pikachu, how dare they copy that design" or "this is not creative and is unoriginal" (not exact quotes but you get the idea). So you are telling me those are constructive criticism statements? If anybody does then they need to learn what constructive criticism actually is. Some of those are actually insults to the designer.

So... please tell me how my original statements that people were just whining and complaining about cuteness and how could people vote for this is wrong? Did I ever say nobody should voice their opinion? Nope, not once, but certain people put those words into my mouth. Thus my statements that people need to actually read and comprehend what is written.

I agree that people should voice their opinion, hell if I didn't then would I have even responded in this thread?? People got all upset at my statements or "complaints" towards negative people... only to come back to attack me for voicing my opinion and to tell me how dare I tell people to NOT voice their opinion. Do you not see how silly that is? How hypocritical that is?

And I'm standing my ground. If people do nothing BUT complain or insult WITHOUT constructive criticism then they are acting douchey and insulting. Twist that however you want, just stop trying to put words into my mouth I didn't say.

cruelnv wrote:I agree that honest and real is the best way to give criticism most of the time. How else will someone get better? Constructive criticism is not necessarily "nice" criticism, however. The stuff you have in class isn't constructive nor is it criticism. It's just commentary. Constructive criticism can be harsh, so long as it is useful.

The problem is that there are too many people on here give criticism without the "constructive" part. That's just pointless. Someone isn't going to change their work if they are just told it embrangles. They need advice on what should change.

For instance, some people said that this design needs a better band name, doesn't look enough like a band shirt, should have a different tour name, looks too much like Pokemon, etc. This is criticism that the artist could choose to use; even if they say it in a mean way. If someone just says they hate it, then that's pretty useless for everyone.

constructive criticism is just a label, and it has a very arbitrary label. the fact of the matter is that criticism is criticism, and only the artist can decide whether it was useful or not. the most well intentioned criticism could be interepreted as offensive and useless by the artist, and it would be true. a criticism becomes constructive when the artist uses it to shape their work. and given that ramyb most often does not listen to criticism as he just keep pumping out terrible chibi designs, none of our criticism is constructive.

in all honesty, couldnt the artist use all of the criticism to change his work? couldnt he see a comment like "i hate it" and try to change his execution next time to avoid getting the same response? wouldnt that make "i hate it" constructive criticism? what if it came from the mouth of van gogh? does that change anything? these questions arent meant to be answered but for you to ask them of yourself.

orzine wrote: a criticism becomes constructive when the artist uses it to shape their work.

I agree with you. But do you consider a statement these statements as constructive criticism?

Oh, barf.

this guy is a one trick pony.

If this is supposed to be a joke, its not even funny. I have never posted before, but I just cannot sit back and say nothing when I see this type of entry. It is an unorigional, overly used, and poorly drawn entry. Sorry to be so blunt.

Looking at this shirt makes me want to fall asleep, for god sakes give me a flipping rock'in shirt.

I just voted for 20 entries that aren't this entry.

This entry gives me gas. When you saw that the next derby was "fake band t-shirts" is this what you thought of? You can't be serious. This is even worse than deadfrog's joke entry for this derby. Are you out of good ideas or something?

I wish you sheeple would quit voting for artists... This is not a first place band T-shirt.

The shirt isn't enough of a joke for you?

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I like Potatoes. Do you like Potatoes?

Can't everyone just agree that this design should be nowhere near the fog ? And that there is no need for Flaming and insulting? Can't we all just get along?

Did i mention i like potatoes?

orzine wrote:constructive criticism is just a label, and it has a very arbitrary label. the fact of the matter is that criticism is criticism, and only the artist can decide whether it was useful or not. the most well intentioned criticism could be interepreted as offensive and useless by the artist, and it would be true. a criticism becomes constructive when the artist uses it to shape their work. and given that ramyb most often does not listen to criticism as he just keep pumping out terrible chibi designs, none of our criticism is constructive.

in all honesty, couldnt the artist use all of the criticism to change his work? couldnt he see a comment like "i hate it" and try to change his execution next time to avoid getting the same response? wouldnt that make "i hate it" constructive criticism? what if it came from the mouth of van gogh? does that change anything? these questions arent meant to be answered but for you to ask them of yourself.

I disagree. Criticism is constructive if it seeks to give direction and offer something that the artist can use. Whether the artist uses it or not is a separate matter.

"I hate it" is not very constructive, but I don't really begrudge comments like that. At least the artist will consider changing something. What would really help is if you provide a reason - WHY do you hate it?

But the comments that are nothing but insults are not constructive in the slightest. It is not helpful to say something like "you are not worthy to be called a designer; nothing you do will ever be art; go die in a hole".

orzine wrote:in all honesty, couldnt the artist use all of the criticism to change his work? couldnt he see a comment like "i hate it" and try to change his execution next time to avoid getting the same response? wouldnt that make "i hate it" constructive criticism? what if it came from the mouth of van gogh? does that change anything? these questions arent meant to be answered but for you to ask them of yourself.

That's a good point; however, I feel there is a better chance for most people to respond to detailed criticism. I simply intended my comment to apply more generally (not necessarily to RamyB). It's just that "I hate it" doesn't really say what you should be changing? The color? The idea? The style? Heck, they could at least say "I hate everything about this" -though I doubt that would be entirely true in most cases- so that the artist would know to start fresh.

Also, just so you know, I always ask myself questions when someone makes a point. I never assume that I have the end-all solution. By knowing and considering the other side's opinion is the only way that you can structure a decent argument anyway.

cruelnv wrote:Yeah, what you said, hoho.

I agree with you CruelNv those types of comments are useless, but we have to take the good with the bad. If someone says it looks like "!&*#^@" obviously we just ignore it or report it and move on...in my view those comments don't occur all too often. Constructive criticism is supposed to be based in compassion for the person being critiqued, correct? However, it is VERY difficult to write a useful yet compassionate critique. I don't have the expectation that everyone is able or wants to spend the time writing such a skillfully worded critique. You say the words "be constructive" to the average person and they will trip all over themselves trying remain "positive" or "nice". When people start trying to censor their true reactions a lot of important things go unsaid. Vague blanket statements don't really help anyone. For instance if I am taking a compassionate approach in an art critique I will say "keep working on it" but if I'm being honest I will say "this looks unfinished or rushed". A good portion of people would call me mean for making that statement. When I leave comments on Woot I always think twice about the reaction I'm going to get and half the time I decide it just isn't worth the drama. In terms of my own artwork, I prefer to hear "the colors are muddy bordering on pukey" rather than "the colors need to be reworked". My point is if we place limitations on or chastise people for voicing their opinions then the flow of information is completely lost. ALSO, there seems to be a developing habit of using the term "constructive criticism" as a defensive term...as in, "I'm not going to acknowledge that statement because it is "un-constructive". People are being villainized under the guise of promoting "constructive criticism" and as a result a lot of people who might have great things to say are being silenced.

I'm not saying we all should be rotten jerks and start name calling. But if we want people to be able to voice their opinions we have to allow everyone to speak their mind...and that includes the jerks. It is up to each individual person to decided how they conduct themselves and we, as a collective whole, can not dictate the outcome.

mikenytola wrote:How does an artist use that to better themselves as a designer? Those statement are PERFECT examples of what I have been talking about from the beginning. But I guess I'm the bad guy for wanting people to be positive.

I looked back over your initial comments. I think you became a "bad guy" because you weren't very clear about your position. It sounded like you were arguing that people should only say nice things. You also made the "try to do it better" argument, which is an oft-used retort that really doesn't work. If such criteria could invalidate negative opinions, why do positive opinions get a pass?

spanishmel wrote:I agree with you CruelNv those types of comments are useless, but we have to take the good with the bad. If someone says it looks like "!&*#^@" obviously we just ignore it or report it and move on...in my view those comments don't occur all too often. Constructive criticism is supposed to be based in compassion for the person being critiqued, correct? However, it is VERY difficult to write a useful yet compassionate critique. I don't have the expectation that everyone is able or wants to spend the time writing such a skillfully worded critique. You say the words "be constructive" to the average person and they will trip all over themselves trying remain "positive" or "nice". When people start trying to censor their true reactions a lot of important things go unsaid. Vague blanket statements don't really help anyone. For instance if I am taking a compassionate approach in an art critique I will say "keep working on it" but if I'm being honest I will say "this looks unfinished or rushed". A good portion of people would call me mean for making that statement. When I leave comments on Woot I always think twice about the reaction I'm going to get and half the time I decide it just isn't worth the drama. In terms of my own artwork, I prefer to hear "the colors are muddy bordering on pukey" rather than "the colors need to be reworked". My point is if we place limitations on or chastise people for voicing their opinions then the flow of information is completely lost. ALSO, there seems to be a developing habit of using the term "constructive criticism" as a defensive term...as in, "I'm not going to acknowledge that statement because it is "un-constructive". People are being villainized under the guise of promoting "constructive criticism" and as a result a lot of people who might have great things to say are being silenced.

I'm not saying we all should be rotten jerks and start name calling. But if we want people to be able to voice their opinions we have to allow everyone to speak their mind...and that includes the jerks. It is up to each individual person to decided how they conduct themselves and we, as a collective whole, can not dictate the outcome.

Maybe you're right about the average person, but the comments you gave as examples of "being mean" don't strike me as mean at all. They're to the point, and they are useful. They are constructive!

"People being silenced" actually works both ways. Sometimes the attacks on a design get so vicious that people who like it are actually afraid to speak up, for fear of being attacked themselves.

spanishmel wrote:...if we want people to be able to voice their opinions we have to allow everyone to speak their mind...and that includes the jerks. It is up to each individual person to decided how they conduct themselves and we, as a collective whole, can not dictate the outcome.

Well, I'd say tear the artist a new one if that's the vibe one wants to express. It's just nice when they give a bit of detail as to why they're disgusted. ;)

... but like you said, it is up to the individual. I was just offering my two bits (which probably means I'm up to about a $2.00 by now).

cruelnv wrote:I agree that honest and real is the best way to give criticism most of the time. How else will someone get better? Constructive criticism is not necessarily "nice" criticism, however. The stuff you have in class isn't constructive nor is it criticism. It's just commentary. Constructive criticism can be harsh, so long as it is useful.

The problem is that there are too many people on here give criticism without the "constructive" part. That's just pointless. Someone isn't going to change their work if they are just told it embrangles. They need advice on what should change.

For instance, some people said that this design needs a better band name, doesn't look enough like a band shirt, should have a different tour name, looks too much like Pokemon, etc. This is criticism that the artist could choose to use; even if they say it in a mean way. If someone just says they hate it, then that's pretty useless for everyone.

As I have said before, if something is irredeemable, what do you say to "critique" it?

I have told many a constituent that their work is great, because there was nothing I could think of to improve it, and it erred on the side of well done. To me, that critique is one of "go for it. It might not do well, but it's worth trying." On the other hand, though, sometimes there is work that would need to be totally torn apart to be better. And in that case, "this is unwearable hooey" seems to work better. I can't say this or that needs improvement if every last bit is horrible. The best advice I can give is that it is simply not good in any way, and requires being either tossed or fully reimagined.

eHalcyon wrote:I looked back over your initial comments. I think you became a "bad guy" because you weren't very clear about your position. It sounded like you were arguing that people should only say nice things. You also made the "try to do it better" argument, which is an oft-used retort that really doesn't work. If such criteria could invalidate negative opinions, why do positive opinions get a pass?

Maybe I wasn't clear, hopefully people who realize what my position is by this point. Pointless insults and complaining, bad, criticism and feedback opinions, good.

A positive opinion is a compliment, a negative one is just being rude. Not negative feedback, but a negative opinion like "thus embrangles". Opinions like that are basically somebody just being a jerk. That is why positive opinions are a pass. That tells the designer, you have done a "good job" and "I like what you did". The designer can then take that as, I'm doing the right thing, keep on doing the right thing.

eHalcyon wrote:I disagree. Criticism is constructive if it seeks to give direction and offer something that the artist can use. Whether the artist uses it or not is a separate matter.

"I hate it" is not very constructive, but I don't really begrudge comments like that. At least the artist will consider changing something. What would really help is if you provide a reason - WHY do you hate it?

But the comments that are nothing but insults are not constructive in the slightest. It is not helpful to say something like "you are not worthy to be called a designer; nothing you do will ever be art; go die in a hole".

If the person TAKES that advice, I would argue it is INCREDIBLY constructive.

Friends of mine recall when Staind was a local band that got booed every time they played anywhere. Think how much better life would be if Staind had taken that advice!

mikenytola wrote:Maybe I wasn't clear, hopefully people who realize what my position is by this point. Pointless insults and complaining, bad, criticism and feedback opinions, good.

A positive opinion is a compliment, a negative one is just being rude. Not negative feedback, but a negative opinion like "thus embrangles". Opinions like that are basically somebody just being a jerk. That is why positive opinions are a pass. That tells the designer, you have done a "good job" and "I like what you did". The designer can then take that as, I'm doing the right thing, keep on doing the right thing.

No, I was just saying that the "try to do a better job" argument doesn't work because it applies just as easily to positive comments. The argument is basically saying "if you can't design better, then your opinion is invalid". If it applies to negative opinions, it should apply to positive opinions as well. But really, it should not apply at all.

AdderXYU wrote:If the person TAKES that advice, I would argue it is INCREDIBLY constructive.

While that may help with over-population, I'm not so sure that's the best way to develop someone's talent (or lack-there-of as the case may be). I'm fairly certain the majority of great work comes from people who used to suck at one point. Though, to be honest, there are a few artists whose work I could have done without (never was a huge fan of DaDa).

AdderXYU wrote:
Friends of mine recall when Staind was a local band that got booed every time they played anywhere. Think how much better life would be if Staind had taken that advice!

Wow. If only... though, if our luck is anything like it is here with successful originality in art, some other band would just step to take their place. But what excuse do we have if we give up?

hehe

cruelnv wrote:While that may help with over-population, I'm not so sure that's the best way to develop someone's talent (or lack-there-of as the case may be). I'm fairly certain the majority of great work comes from people who used to suck at one point. Though, to be honest, there are a few artists whose work I could have done without (never was a huge fan of DaDa).

But how do they get better? If an artist never listens to criticism and assumes what they are doing is perfect, then they will never change, and the art they are producing will remain bad. Criticism helps to make that artist better, especially but not exclusively, when given by another artist of the same medium.

Apologies for the double post. Please delete.

mikenytola wrote:Maybe I wasn't clear, hopefully people who realize what my position is by this point. Pointless insults and complaining, bad, criticism and feedback opinions, good.

A positive opinion is a compliment, a negative one is just being rude. Not negative feedback, but a negative opinion like "thus embrangles". Opinions like that are basically somebody just being a jerk. That is why positive opinions are a pass. That tells the designer, you have done a "good job" and "I like what you did". The designer can then take that as, I'm doing the right thing, keep on doing the right thing.

Why does the positive opinion carry the weight of "keep going" when the negative opinion gets no weight? Shouldn't it carry the weight of "don't keep going"?

As for constructive criticism, I would agree that at large critiques should be preferable to rabid complaining, mudslinging, and accusation throwing, but if a designer makes no attempt to actually take any of that to heart, then those same set of people still get to be as vocal about it as far as I'm concerned.

I mean, let the "complainers" complain. They obviously haven't dented Ramy's popularity in the last half of a year. Don't like it, steer WELL clear of the discussion for Ramy's entries.

Contrary to other beliefs, people like Adder, etc., DON'T just tear people down. They DO ride designers for not giving their best or ignoring constructive criticism, and I feel that's deserved. Whether or not it is HEEDED is an entirely different issue.

kylemittskus wrote:But how do they get better? If an artist never listens to criticism and assumes what they are doing is perfect, then they will never change, and the art they are producing will remain bad. Criticism helps to make that artist better, especially but not exclusively, when given by another artist of the same medium.

My comment was in regards to following advice about crawling into a hole to die... not about taking non-lethal criticism. Unless you're for lethal criticism? (Now that should be a band name)

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I LOVE this color scheme! Amazing job <3 GMV

arwerther wrote:I was wondering how long we had to wait for the first bunny/penguin shirt. Is anyone else getting sick of the same old recycled subject matter?

thank you. i now hate pandas, too. It's like watching my grandma order commemorative plates. Do the people who vote for these actually buy them?

mcosgrove wrote:thank you. i now hate pandas, too. It's like watching my grandma order commemorative plates. Do the people who vote for these actually buy them?

Your grandmother orders commemorative plates. Wooters buy shirts like this. It is sad but it is true.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I just had to log in and vote for this. If it makes to the top three, I will buy it.

kylemittskus wrote:But how do they get better? If an artist never listens to criticism and assumes what they are doing is perfect, then they will never change, and the art they are producing will remain bad. Criticism helps to make that artist better, especially but not exclusively, when given by another artist of the same medium.

Agreed.

In fact...

I'd argue that someone who creates illustrations/designs and doesn't strive to learn and better themselves cannot be considered an artist.

Stormink wrote:Agreed.

In fact...

I'd argue that someone who creates illustrations/designs and doesn't strive to learn and better themselves cannot be considered an artist.

thats a little dangerous. i would take it a step back and say that an artist who doesn not listen to criticism is not worthy of respect

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I'm seeing a lot of good comments about how people should go about critiquing, whether it be constructive, positive, or harsh.
But does every comment need to be about critiquing? Complaints without critique are just as valid and this is why:

I don't think Ramyb needs critiquing, he's got a solid style. But I do think he's using his talent and following to put out sub-par stuff that is off-theme, which then robs more eligible shirts of a shot at derby victory. And if I want to speak my frustration without some sort of "constructive criticism" involved, I am perfectly in-line to do so.

Stuntdummy wrote:I'm seeing a lot of good comments about how people should go about critiquing, whether it be constructive, positive, or harsh.
But does every comment need to be about critiquing? Complaints without critique are just as valid and this is why:

I don't think Ramyb needs critiquing, he's got a solid style. But I do think he's using his talent and following to put out sub-par stuff that is off-theme, which then robs more eligible shirts of a shot at derby victory. And if I want to speak my frustration without some sort of "constructive criticism" involved, I am perfectly in-line to do so.

He has an absolutely solid style. For otaku fan art and nerdcons. Not for a legit shirt site. It is certainly arguable that woot is not a legit shirt site, but still, take it to cafepress. Start "The Dojo of the Same Design 100 Ways" and rake in your profits. There is no reason we should have to deal with anything this uninspired week after week.

ORIGINAL AND EXCLUSIVE shirts, says the FAQ. None of these are original. They are the same exact thing every 15 year old with a mangafetish draws. Every shirt looks the same. Every concept is stale. As for exclusive, that is only because there is no other shirt site out there who would accept this level of work

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

i usually chime in about blah blah, but i havent seen any Must Have shirts in this derby, so i dont have to complain about this one

yay

AdderXYU wrote:

Though the scenario does hammer home just how bad the majority tends to be at picking things. Hell, I still think Obama's "popular vote" margin was tooooo thin for any card with Sarah Palin on it.

Like how a meteor passing within however many hundreds of thousands of miles of Earth is considered a "near-miss." hurrrrr.

simontsui wrote:I just had to log in and vote for this. If it makes to the top three, I will buy it.

Join date, japanese reference in username, etc.

hoho moar Bunnies!!

cleverconveyence wrote:Join date, japanese reference in username, etc.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwPLQ43JVYU

this shirt is cute. i love space and bunnies. i like cute things. i want.

AdderXYU wrote:He has an absolutely solid style. For otaku fan art and nerdcons. Not for a legit shirt site. It is certainly arguable that woot is not a legit shirt site, but still, take it to cafepress. Start "The Dojo of the Same Design 100 Ways" and rake in your profits. There is no reason we should have to deal with anything this uninspired week after week.

ORIGINAL AND EXCLUSIVE shirts, says the FAQ. None of these are original. They are the same exact thing every 15 year old with a mangafetish draws. Every shirt looks the same. Every concept is stale. As for exclusive, that is only because there is no other shirt site out there who would accept this level of work

I know, dude, I know...
I don't like his style either, but I do think he could put out better "ideas" with his style.
Really, I don't care what people's styles are, even if it is mangafetish. I just can't stand things that are off-theme or unshirtable. There's no excuse for it. A design shouldn't ever need explanation for why it's on theme; it should be undeniably spot-on, themewise and shirtability. I don't know the last time I saw a Ramyb design that was either or both.

Stuntdummy wrote:I know, dude, I know...
I don't like his style either, but I do think he could put out better "ideas" with his style.
Really, I don't care what people's styles are, even if it is mangafetish. I just can't stand things that are off-theme or unshirtable. There's no excuse for it. A design shouldn't ever need explanation for why it's on theme; it should be undeniably spot-on, themewise and shirtability. I don't know the last time I saw a Ramyb design that was either or both.

The last time I did was on deviantart. Over there, drawing pointless desu is always on topic ;)

As for here, I would argue even his best done piece was "off" in some area. Many weren't even on theme. Quite a few pushed common rejection boundaries. Even when he tried on a piece like "the open sea," it looked too blotchy like a live trace. But as I've well learned, art is written by the victors. You sell something, and it becomes worth something. It's the Walmart mentality... I get what I want, and I get it cheap, and by wanting it and getting it cheap, it is the best.

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

This is really cute - you have my vote! I did the Bunny Holly design, so I guess we both have that in common. Good luck today!

Re: Interplanetary Bunnies

I think people want the most for their money . . . .My Heavens,don't buy my Hackneyed shirts then . . . Haa!