Derby #157: Reinterpreting Famous Art Titles

La Pieta by Michelangelo

Everything

Rejected because: Everything

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yankeebird


quality posts: 7 Private Messages yankeebird
Re: La Pieta by Michelangelo


Definitely NOT a shirt.woot color.

sasham62


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sasham62
Re: La Pieta by Michelangelo


Also not the Woot Template, and the submitter reworked the original artwork (see here) rather than reinterpreting the title.

mjc613


quality posts: 47 Private Messages mjc613
Re: La Pieta by Michelangelo


photo, not original artwork, not woot shirt color, not what woot is looking for

briansantamaria


quality posts: 0 Private Messages briansantamaria
mjc613 wrote:photo, not original artwork, not woot shirt color, not what woot is looking for


If you don't like it, that's fine, but there is plenty of original artwork that is created without a pen. And it is a play on the name of the work AS WELL AS the work itself. The irony and picture referencing the pun in the name and the works historical context in the modern age... the man who attacked the work with a hammer.

Do I doubt that Woot will reject it? No. But, that's because everyone seems to be stuck on cute pen and ink illustrations. Which is fine. It's just not what this is. Doesn't mean its not an original work. Doesn't mean it doesn't follow the rules.

briansantamaria


quality posts: 0 Private Messages briansantamaria
sasham62 wrote:Also not the Woot Template, and the submitter reworked the original artwork (see here) rather than reinterpreting the title.


Did you include a link because you thought I was unaware of the original? its not just a photograph of the original, it is a photograph of Lazlo Toth attacking it. And it is clearly a reinterpretation of the title as the reinterpretation of the title is printed right on the design... 'la pinata' as opposed to 'la pieta'.

I understand it doesn't follow the normal, successful woot shirt model, but why does that make it less valid as a design? I thought the simple pun on the name of the work, when including the context of its own destruction with a man swinging a blunt object was an interesting, simple, and fun comment on the destruction of classic art in a modern digital age. It requires an informed audience... not to sound pretentious, but one who understands the name of the work by looking at it, and also knows it's history with relation to lazlo toth, and its significance to the art world and the catholic church.

And finally, I did NOT reinterpret the original work. I intentionally left it alone. I did not color it, disfigure it, or misrepresent the image of the original in any way, except to rebalance the newspaper clipping that depicts it. It is about reimagining the work inside of a reworking of its own name.

You don't like it. that's fine. it's not the best thing I've ever seen either. But that doesn't make it illegitimate.

paigeg


quality posts: 7 Private Messages paigeg
briansantamaria wrote:If you don't like it, that's fine, but there is plenty of original artwork that is created without a pen. And it is a play on the name of the work AS WELL AS the work itself. The irony and picture referencing the pun in the name and the works historical context in the modern age... the man who attacked the work with a hammer.

Do I doubt that Woot will reject it? No. But, that's because everyone seems to be stuck on cute pen and ink illustrations. Which is fine. It's just not what this is. Doesn't mean its not an original work. Doesn't mean it doesn't follow the rules.

That's exactly what folks are trying to tell you - turn it down a notch and listen. Woot doesn't have this color, this is not on Woot's template, and in general, photos are rejectionable. Woot is for illustrations - hand-drawn stuff. Can't say I've never seen a photo get by, but...
So, basically - this sub doesn't follow the rules. At all. It is what it is.

briansantamaria


quality posts: 0 Private Messages briansantamaria
paigeg wrote:That's exactly what folks are trying to tell you - turn it down a notch and listen. Woot doesn't have this color, this is not on Woot's template, and in general, photos are rejectionable. Woot is for illustrations - hand-drawn stuff. Can't say I've never seen a photo get by, but...
So, basically - this sub doesn't follow the rules. At all. It is what it is.


Why is Woot only for hand-drawn illustrations? Because you say it is? That's not in the rules. And the template thing is fine, but all their standards say is that it will be changed if it's made. It's not going to get made so it doesn't matter.

Why are you so stuck on saying that since you don't like something it's against the rules? Is it possible that something could be a completely legitimate submission AND you don't like it?

hannaz92


quality posts: 0 Private Messages hannaz92
briansantamaria wrote:Why is Woot only for hand-drawn illustrations? Because you say it is? That's not in the rules. And the template thing is fine, but all their standards say is that it will be changed if it's made. It's not going to get made so it doesn't matter.

Why are you so stuck on saying that since you don't like something it's against the rules? Is it possible that something could be a completely legitimate submission AND you don't like it?


I am pretty sure she was just trying to help you understand if you submit for another derby. And as a side note since you are stuck on the picture thing. If you did not take the picture you used in the submission, you can not submit it either. Since it isn't actually your work.

missmissa07


quality posts: 12 Private Messages missmissa07
briansantamaria wrote:Why is Woot only for hand-drawn illustrations? Because you say it is? That's not in the rules. And the template thing is fine, but all their standards say is that it will be changed if it's made. It's not going to get made so it doesn't matter.

Why are you so stuck on saying that since you don't like something it's against the rules? Is it possible that something could be a completely legitimate submission AND you don't like it?


Woot is only for hand-drawn illustrations because photos are too hard to print. Typically, photos consist of a lot more than just 6 colors, and there is a 6 color limit on designs because it is too much work/would be too expensive to allow more than that. And it is in the rules, as if you paid attention to past derbies you would realize that people have been rejected many times in the past for using photos in their entries.

The comments on this design do not exist to insult it because the various people don't like it. They exist to point out what is literally wrong with the design that is/was going to cause it to get rejected. Woot has rejected hundreds of tees in the past for not being on a woot templet. They have particular shirt colors that they allow - they simply cannot print a tee on a blank that they do not have.

Please do some research before submitting a design next time, and don't necessary become overwhelmingly defensive because people are trying to help you.

I am sorry if this post came off as snooty, that is not my intention. It just baffles me when artists become irritated or automatically assume people are "bashing" them when they simply did not follow the rules.

profbrendan


quality posts: 7 Private Messages profbrendan
briansantamaria wrote:Why is Woot only for hand-drawn illustrations...Is it possible that something could be a completely legitimate submission AND you don't like it?


Everything I was gonna say about colors and photos has already been said, but I'll just add a couple things.

The derby theme was to reinterpret the name of a famous piece, not to parody or reference the original work. Though this is sort of a grey area for some titles and has admittedly flummoxed many people in this derby, it's what they were looking for. So if you wanted to use La Pieta as your reference, the better thing to do would have been to reinterpret the title itself, or the translation, The Pity. Not the original statue or Lazlo Toth. Look at some of the other rejections and you can maybe see what I'm talking about.

As far as the template in your shirt comp is concerned, I don't think Woot really cares, considering the majority of shirt comps are on other presentation templates, mine included. Is that always gonna be 100% true? Nope. But I would bet that as long as your print-ready art file is on their template and everything else is in line with the rules, it's probably fine.

No one is saying that it's breaking rules because they don't like it, they're saying it because it's true. Maybe don't take it personal, just learn from it so you don't get rejected in the future.

sogj


quality posts: 15 Private Messages sogj
Re: La Pieta by Michelangelo


You can't use photos because they can't be printed. Woot will not CMYK process, only spot. If you want to use a photo, take it to Threadless.

Woot will not print artwork that wasn't originally yours. If you didn't take the photo, they could get sued.

Woot doesn't offer a shirt in pink. They will reject your guide.

You broke the rules. Get over it and read them next time.

I refuse to answer on the grounds that I don't know the answer.

sogj


quality posts: 15 Private Messages sogj
missmissa07 wrote:It just baffles me when artists become irritated or automatically assume people are "bashing" them when they simply did not follow the rules.


This.

I refuse to answer on the grounds that I don't know the answer.

creativedv8tion


quality posts: 0 Private Messages creativedv8tion
briansantamaria wrote: Doesn't mean it doesn't follow the rules.


Wow, denial much? Look, I know you're embarrassed because everyone pointed out all the reasons that makes it apparent that you didn't bother to read the rules, but yes, your submission violated many of the rules, THEREFORE it did not follow the rules.

3blackbelt3


quality posts: 4 Private Messages 3blackbelt3
creativedv8tion wrote:Wow, denial much? Look, I know you're embarrassed because everyone pointed out all the reasons that makes it apparent that you didn't bother to read the rules, but yes, your submission violated many of the rules, THEREFORE it did not follow the rules.


This.

mjc613


quality posts: 47 Private Messages mjc613
briansantamaria wrote:If you don't like it, that's fine, ....


My post had nothing to do with whether this is likeable or whether this is art. I posted some of the reasons that woot could reject it.

This is a contest, and as such there are rules that everyone has to follow to make sure that everyone has the same chance to win. There are the weekly rules, based on what woot has in the warehouse and what their printers can achieve, as well as who they want to sell to. In that category, you picked a shirt color they don't have and too many inks for their machine.

There are also weekly rules concerning the theme. You missed that also.

If you want to enter this in a more open forum, try DBH or Threadless. DBH has a more artistic community - but a lot more competition, and Threadless is up for everything.

tgentry


quality posts: 111 Private Messages tgentry

Staff

mjc613 wrote:My post had nothing to do with whether this is likeable or whether this is art. I posted some of the reasons that woot could reject it.

This is a contest, and as such there are rules that everyone has to follow to make sure that everyone has the same chance to win. There are the weekly rules, based on what woot has in the warehouse and what their printers can achieve, as well as who they want to sell to. In that category, you picked a shirt color they don't have and too many inks for their machine.

There are also weekly rules concerning the theme. You missed that also.

If you want to enter this in a more open forum, try DBH or Threadless. DBH has a more artistic community - but a lot more competition, and Threadless is up for everything.


All signs point to troll. I think this person is just looking to bait you and anyone into wasting as much time on them as possible.

cosmiccow


quality posts: 0 Private Messages cosmiccow
Re: La Pieta by Michelangelo


briansantamaria: From the standpoint of someone who has a degree in art history, as a work of art, the design is legitimate. Not necessarily good, but it's very much in the vein of mid-80's thru mid-90's political/social art.
However, shirt.woot is not an art gallery, and the derby is not an exhibition. It is a contest, with rules, with the goal, quite frankly, of finding the design they will be able to sell the most of. Those rules entail the printing process used (i.e. how many colors can be present), what you are allowed to use in your creation, and what shirt colors are available. You, quite frankly, broke every single one of those.
You didn't take the photo, that's obvious. You say as such. That's a rule broken.
Even if you HAD taken the photo, the use of color and gradient would well exceed the 6 spot-color limit. That's a rule broken.
Woot makes it clear what colors they have available for shirts. Hot pink is not one of them (thank god for that). That's a rule broken.

If you had just commented, "I know it's not printable, but I really wanted to share this design," then fine. Instead, you try to say that something that violates a number of rules that have long been established doesn't in fact violate those rules, which, quite frankly, is astoundingly obstinate and silly. It would be like if a schoolteacher caught a student who had written test answers on their hand, and they kept going, "No, those aren't really there! You're wrong!"

mjc613


quality posts: 47 Private Messages mjc613
tgentry wrote:All signs point to troll. I think this person is just looking to bait you and anyone into wasting as much time on them as possible.


I knew that was possible, but I figured this response would come in handy again(and again and..), but in the future, I would just have to cut and paste.

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