Shirt.Woot

derekfilley wrote:ok...

so pyrin's idea about no foggies in the hot 6: i like
Poshgirl's random sort default page: i like
Jack's all designs on different weeks: i dont like after a day or so there would be nothing left to say about the designs so the forum would degenerate into petty debates and name calling (even more than it does now *cough*)

I agree with both pyrin's and poshgirl's ideas like you. However, though I can see the danger in announcing a derby early. I wonder if woot(!), being the forward thinking and adapting group that it is, could try and implement this system for one or two weeks. Then we could see if we ultimately like it or not. Because for something so different as Jack's idea to announce themes a week early I think we really just have to experience it to see what would truly happen.

TehCaspia wrote:The "cities coast to coast" shirt is cute, but umm the Mall of America should actually be placed in the Twin Cities, and not be sitting somewhere over South Dakota...yeah...so... Minnesota w00t

double w00t!

Spare some change?

Even an extra day could be enough, like so:

Wed: Derby X theme announced
Thurs: Derby X-1 closes for voting
Fri: Derby X opens for submission

Also, I'm liking some of these new designs a lot. My top 5 so far includes 2 of them. In order of ranking, though not in any order by favorites:

Jack31081 wrote:I honestly don't see how ANYONE can say this method isn't better than the current one.

Now, I can see why woot wouldn't want to switch, as it would draw fewer people to the site. If you only have to show up once to vote on all entries, you hit the site less than if people are submitting all week long. Yes, you can wait until Wednesday to even look at entries, but honestly, who does that?

Your initial idea would only work if the number of submissions or submissions by artist were limited. (neither of which I want to see).

Because of the sheer number of designs, after collecting one week's worth, I doubt most purchasers would get much past page 2 or 3 without running out of time/interest. That would be unfair to the designs on the later pages.
My method is I check the derby submissions early -and scan through all the designs voting as I go on those I like/would buy/think deserve a vote (more on this later); and I check frequently during the weekend and Monday (anything submitted after Monday won't stand much chance IMO).
I LIKE the initial-default sort is by submission-time (random would be pointless -I've never used it and can't think of what it's for), that way I scan the new submissions and vote as above until I reach the ones I've already seen.
In That way I don't need to review 100's of designs getting bored/jaded along the way.
During the weekend, after reviewing the new submissions, I then sort by VOTES and check the fog. If I find a highly placed shirt (fog and within the next 10 or so) that I voted for that I decide I really don't like or won't buy after-all, I UNvote it. This works well, and is most fair, also IMO. If the 'little guys' designs get an extra vote why do you care? Let 'em have the pat-on-the-back.
As a voter-purchaser and not a designer, my method serves me best, and I suggest others also.
For the designers out there suggesting these changes, it sounds to ME, like you're trying to get your designs better placement only. I urge all you designers to stop it.
I do agree that more time to design for the theme might be a good thing - so maybe that could be announced earlier, maybe a day earlier, but I think maybe woot wants the designs to come in over several days during the week and too much advance notice would skew a major number of submissions to the first day creating a big clog.
Actually, it must be running pretty well, in woots eyes, as it is right now.

I'd *hate* to see some of the other suggestions implemented. (However, if you want to give me a vote, per design, for each and every woot I've purchased, I'd like that - I have 60 (thatwouldhavehelped GIMetro, Jack, if I couldhavevotedforit 60 timesinsteadofONCE).

And no foggies in the hot?? WHAT'S FAIR ABOUT THAT? or realistic? or the point? except to bring up an otherwise lower voted design? Again, where's the fairness in that?

===
Oh, and before I go, anyone want to take a stab at checking to see if there are multiple accounts per designer?
Anyone else think that these three are all the same person: lnk2626; Mr Puggle; fletchergreenfield.
Check out all four of the rejected raccoon shirts. not drawn by the same person?

AdderXYU wrote:Even an extra day could be enough, like so:

Wed: Derby X theme announced
Thurs: Derby X-1 closes for voting
Fri: Derby X opens for submission

Also, I'm liking some of these new designs a lot. My top 5 so far includes 2 of them. In order of ranking, though not in any order by favorites:

I couldn't disagree more. Those are all horrible ...except for the snake train one.

Maybe good ideas but execution is seriously lacking.

chippyswans wrote:I couldn't disagree more. Those are all horrible ...except for the snake train one.

Maybe good ideas but execution is seriously lacking.

Thanks for the incredibly insightful commentary. I'm not one who gets insulted too easily, but "those are all horrible" is something that really doesn't need to be said. It's not a meaningful contribution to this conversation in any way. Granted, I'm a little hurt that you feel my execution was "seriously lacking." I thought the Shel Silverstein art style was pretty appropriate for the subject matter, but that's another conversation. What I'm really rather upset about is that you seem to feel it's your duty to dictate what someone else should like.

Do you really think that AdderXYU cares that you disagree with his/her tastes? I can't speak for everyone, but I'm willing to bet that not many here do. Are you going to change AdderXYU's mind? I'd say that's pretty unlikely. Are you going to get anyone who voted for these designs to retract their votes? Doubtful. So why'd you write the post, then? Just curious what your motivation was for the commentary.

shiftypixel wrote:Thanks for the incredibly insightful commentary. I'm not one who gets insulted too easily, but "those are all horrible" is something that really doesn't need to be said. It's not a meaningful contribution to this conversation in any way. Granted, I'm a little hurt that you feel my execution was "seriously lacking." I thought the Shel Silverstein art style was pretty appropriate for the subject matter, but that's another conversation. What I'm really rather upset about is that you seem to feel it's your duty to dictate what someone else should like.

Do you really think that AdderXYU cares that you disagree with his/her tastes? I can't speak for everyone, but I'm willing to bet that not many here do. Are you going to change AdderXYU's mind? I'd say that's pretty unlikely. Are you going to get anyone who voted for these designs to retract their votes? Doubtful. So why'd you write the post, then? Just curious what your motivation was for the commentary.

Huh? That person can think that...I was only inserting my thought on them. Alot of them have color problems...the tree with the building on it isn't a well made t-shirt graphic. I could go into more depth I just didn't want to right now. I was just making a quick point that I didn't like the designs mentioned....just like anyone can and likely will say about mine. Isn't that what we're supposed to do here?

chippyswans wrote:Huh? That person can think that...I was only inserting my thought on them. Alot of them have color problems...the tree with the building on it isn't a well made t-shirt graphic. I could go into more depth I just didn't want to right now. I was just making a quick point that I didn't like the designs mentioned....just like anyone can and likely will say about mine. Isn't that what we're supposed to do here?

Furthermore, I submit a top five for almost every derby and many people say "yeah, those are my favorite too!" or "dude, what the hell are you thinking?" and i dont get all pissy. please, lighten up and enjoy this.

I'm just surprised someone actually liked my building tree design. I had the broken apart building and couldn't decide what to do with it...so I stuck a tree in it. Nice to see it made someones list.

Pyrin wrote:For my two cents, I also think it would be nice if fog entries weren't allowed to be featured in the "New Hotness" sidebar. They're already getting enough attention for being in the fog- they don't need the double advertising. It would free up space for more middleground entries to get in the spotlight (and it's been pretty well proven that designs that make it into the Hotness get a pretty decent boost... I've been in and out of it enough, I should know. XD)

I think this is a great idea. I also think the designs in the New Hotness section should show neither hotness nor total votes for the design, and they should be randomized. If it's hot, then it's hot. If someone wants to see how high in the count they are, then they can find it by sorting in Votes order (or use their browser's text search function). Make the New Hotness like the fog without the counts visible. By doing that and removing the fog entries from New Hotness, I think it would give more entries a fair chance.

chippyswans wrote:Huh? That person can think that...I was only inserting my thought on them. Alot of them have color problems...the tree with the building on it isn't a well made t-shirt graphic. I could go into more depth I just didn't want to right now. I was just making a quick point that I didn't like the designs mentioned....just like anyone can and likely will say about mine. Isn't that what we're supposed to do here?

All I'm trying to say is that you wrote a very short, very negative comment with no constructive criticism and no explanation. It's not like you're going to get stuck having to buy any of these shirts. None of them look like they're going to be winners. I just didn't see any reason to go out of your way to put these people down.

By the way, I do like your lamp post. It's got good placement on the shirt.

Well, since we all know a halloween derby is coming, people should have had plenty of time to get their designs ready (even slow newbies like me). So if the quality of submissions goes up (a highly subjective call there by the way) then that's one argument for giving a longer lead time on themes. Otherwise, I don't see much need to change. Although if our number of votes = number of woots I would so be throwing all mine at city blocks. I really want that shirt.

TehCaspia wrote:The "cities coast to coast" shirt is cute, but umm the Mall of America should actually be placed in the Twin Cities, and not be sitting somewhere over South Dakota...yeah...so... Minnesota w00t

It's a cool idea for a shirt. Some of the things are misplaced, but you kind of have to give some artistic license so everything doesn't mush together on the design.

My only real problem with the shirt is that it says "HOLLYWOOD" for L.A. This breaks the rules because we aren't supposed to be using text at all. I've seen a few other designs with letters in them, but Woot doesn't seem to be axeing those, either. I guess some people can get away with it.

i would love to start a woot reject site! so many cool designs never get printed

JohnQ118 wrote:And no foggies in the hot?? WHAT'S FAIR ABOUT THAT? or realistic? or the point? except to bring up an otherwise lower voted design? Again, where's the fairness in that?

To me, losing the Fog entries from the New Hotness would be fair (if implemented) because Fog entries are the established hotness, not the new hotness, in my mind. I think the New Hotness designation was created mainly to give newly popular entries a chance at more visibility- Fog entries no longer require that, as they already benefit from larger size.

I think the New Hotness thing might be fun for Woot to play around with a bit- it would be interesting to see how it might effect voting if for one derby it only showed entries with less than 100 votes, or only entries submitted that day, or only entries by new derby submitters.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the current system of New Hotness, though- I think the shirts there have largely been the shirts that the Woot community would like to buy. Which is probably why all four of the Fog entries are currently listed there...

chippyswans wrote:I couldn't disagree more. Those are all horrible ...except for the snake train one.

Maybe good ideas but execution is seriously lacking.

If you liked one, you certainly could disagree more.

I don't think they're all flawlessly executed (and I won't lie, that walking building one is half-past-bizarre and certainly not most people's cup of tea) but to me, they're done well enough to be marketable. In contrast, there are a lot of entries that are executed flawlessly, clearly time-consuming ideas, clearly artistic minds at work, that do nothing for me. If I walked into a store, and all the derby entries were in the shirt department, I'd likely walk out with one of the five I posted if I bought one at all.

I just wanted to highlight a couple back-runners that I felt should get some more exposure... you hate them, it's still exposure. I don't want there to be bickering on my behalf, though I appreciate the defense. If you disagree, I'd love to see what you'd call your top picks. Maybe I or others have overlooked them. Just because a design may be a long shot doesn't mean it shouldn't have a chance to gain some fans.

Hmm.. Despite the earlier conflict, it doesn't look like the woot staff have any problems with the satellite lights design.

The voters don't seem to mind it, either.. from all the hotness trends I've seen, I'm willing to bet that it's leading.

Vilgrom wrote:Hmm.. Despite the earlier conflict, it doesn't look like the woot staff have any problems with the satellite lights design.

The voters don't seem to mind it, either.. from all the hotness trends I've seen, I'm willing to bet that it's leading.

Nope. I think I'll surf the NASA site for something for a future design. There are some pretty cool pictures on there that would make great t-shirts, so if it's fair game....

kriscad wrote:i would love to start a woot reject site! so many cool designs never get printed

That is the intention of my site, http://bestlosers.com. I hope to have things setup within the next week or two to allow people to upload their old shirts and link to wherever they might be selling them. It is especially relevant now that Derby #1 shirts can now be sold!

AdderXYU wrote:If you liked one, you certainly could disagree more.

I don't think they're all flawlessly executed (and I won't lie, that walking building one is half-past-bizarre and certainly not most people's cup of tea) but to me, they're done well enough to be marketable. In contrast, there are a lot of entries that are executed flawlessly, clearly time-consuming ideas, clearly artistic minds at work, that do nothing for me. If I walked into a store, and all the derby entries were in the shirt department, I'd likely walk out with one of the five I posted if I bought one at all.

I just wanted to highlight a couple back-runners that I felt should get some more exposure... you hate them, it's still exposure. I don't want there to be bickering on my behalf, though I appreciate the defense. If you disagree, I'd love to see what you'd call your top picks. Maybe I or others have overlooked them. Just because a design may be a long shot doesn't mean it shouldn't have a chance to gain some fans.

Well...that's why I included them in my reply. You like them and thought enough to post them...so I kept them in my reply out of respect. I'lll post a list of my top 5 later in the process.

Well, Killopo listened to our requests, and the new placement is doing better than ever!

Not only does this prove the effectiveness of the "delete" function, but it also makes this shirt flawless artistically. Killopo, I'm definately adding you to the list of artists whose style I seek to imitate, good on you!

I'd like to see this one in the fog.

thatrobert wrote:That is the intention of my site, http://bestlosers.com. I hope to have things setup within the next week or two to allow people to upload their old shirts and link to wherever they might be selling them. It is especially relevant now that Derby #1 shirts can now be sold!

Im actually talking with tshirt companies in my area to see what kinda prices I can get. Will let everyone know what I come up with, hopefully by end of the week.

derekfilley wrote:

Well, Killopo listened to our requests, and the new placement is doing better than ever!

Not only does this prove the effectiveness of the "delete" function, but it also makes this shirt flawless artistically. Killopo, I'm definately adding you to the list of artists whose style I seek to imitate, good on you!

I'd like to see this one in the fog.

Just got it there.

Saw it before and didn't vote, due to placement.

Saw it now and voted.

Vilgrom wrote:Just got it there.

Saw it before and didn't vote, due to placement.

Saw it now and voted.

*High Five*

geekfactor12 wrote:To me, losing the Fog entries from the New Hotness would be fair (if implemented) because Fog entries are the established hotness, not the new hotness, in my mind. I think the New Hotness designation was created mainly to give newly popular entries a chance at more visibility-

not true not true.
The Hotness is showing recent highest voting activity for newly or continuing popular designs. You should expect the foggies to be there more often. There have been designs in the fog that stalled in receiving votes, were deflated and knocked out. To my mind I want to see the true voting popularity in the hotness - maybe you'd be happier and we could agree that more designs should appear in the hotness? (perhaps 10 instead of 6) or that it's a variable sized field?

Just curious ......

Does anyone even know what stickball is? God I'm old.

kriscad wrote:i would love to start a woot reject site! so many cool designs never get printed

it's already been done.

AdderXYU wrote:
I just wanted to highlight a couple back-runners that I felt should get some more exposure... Just because a design may be a long shot doesn't mean it shouldn't have a chance to gain some fans.

This is a great point.

I would like to see some more exposure and votes for the bus.
Another modern art design.

(folks, there's skulls in there)

rlitteriowoot wrote:Just curious ......

Does anyone even know what stickball is? God I'm old.[/url]

I thought it was city baseball, but uh, apparently not.

derekfilley wrote:I thought it was city baseball, but uh, apparently not.

not quite. it's playing with a cutoff broomstick and a rubber ball or tennis ball or Spaldeen, typically.
you really should google more: *
The shirt design image defines the strike zone drawn on the wall behind the batter.

chippyswans wrote:Furthermore, I submit a top five for almost every derby and many people say "yeah, those are my favorite too!" or "dude, what the hell are you thinking?" and i dont get all pissy. please, lighten up and enjoy this.

There is a big difference between "Dude, what are you thinking" and "Those are all horrible".

derekfilley wrote:*High Five*

Voted now myself...didn't realize it was repositioned.

snarkygal wrote:There is a big difference between "Dude, what are you thinking" and "Those are all horrible".

wow.

either way i dont like them.

rlitteriowoot wrote:Just curious ......

Does anyone even know what stickball is? God I'm old.

Big fan of anything baseball/stickball on here...but the image is too big for me. Gave it a vote just to support the sports.

JohnQ118 wrote:not true not true.
The Hotness is showing recent highest voting activity for newly or continuing popular designs. You should expect the foggies to be there more often. There have been designs in the fog that stalled in receiving votes, were deflated and knocked out. To my mind I want to see the true voting popularity in the hotness - maybe you'd be happier and we could agree that more designs should appear in the hotness? (perhaps 10 instead of 6) or that it's a variable sized field?

As I said previously, I have no problem with New Hotness as it currently functions. My only feeling on the issue is that it would be more interesting to me if it were a different set of designs than the ones I can easily see in the fog.

To that end, maybe different statistics for each derby being featured in that area would be most interesting of all- most popular designs among east coasters, most popular among 1 Woot buyers, most popular submissions among Woot staff, most popular among former winners, etc.

It's fine as is, but I like variation. It keeps things fresh, and to me seeing the fog repeated in a new column is kind of dull.

I really wish you guys would stop voting for a boring already done tetris shirt and vote for goelzjr's Future City Traffic. That one the most creative/interesting I've seen in a long time.

EDIT: Oh, and vote for mine too :P

JohnQ118 wrote:not quite. it's playing with a cutoff broomstick and a rubber ball or tennis ball or Spaldeen, typically.
you really should google more: *
The shirt design image defines the strike zone drawn on the wall behind the batter.

I'm actually a fanatic wikipedia reader, but as I assumed I already knew what stickball was, I didn't see the need ;-)

JohnQ118 wrote:The Hotness is showing recent highest voting activity for newly or continuing popular designs. You should expect the foggies to be there more often.

Exactly. We *expect* them to be there- which is why we don't need to *see* them there. They're in the fog already- they're popular. We get it. ;D

Pyrin wrote:Exactly. We *expect* them to be there- which is why we don't need to *see* them there. They're in the fog already- they're popular. We get it. ;D

well, I like them being there because if they aren't, you know they might be losing their position in the fog. It just gives you an idea which shirts people actually like the best, regardless if they were submitted the first day or not.