dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

snarkygal wrote:W_T_F is a play nice probation?




The probation I've given out for general nastiness.
I'm sure there is an official way of phrasing it.
Woot would like to be a friendly, safe for work environment.

WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

AdderXYU wrote:So I should post all derby related items, such as comments on individual shirts, in world of woot shirts, not in the threads the staff provided to talk about individual shirts?



What did it really have to do with the shirt?
Your complaint was it was a child.
The child didn't need to read it. You could say it here, you can start a thread, you can gripe directly to Joel.
That entire thread turned into a debate.

As a non artist, I liked the shirt. It had a childlike quality and it was drawn by a child, not an adult drawing badly.

There are plenty of poorly drawn shirts in the contest....go pick on those adults.



WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

AdderXYU wrote:So I should post all derby related items, such as comments on individual shirts, in world of woot shirts, not in the threads the staff provided to talk about individual shirts?

Also, you're made of bias. A kid came to an adult forum. They are getting an adult forum experience. Make up rules with your own kids, not with adults.



An adult forum that is suppose to be PG13. Not aimed towards kids, but kid friendly.

WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

bluchez


quality posts: 2 Private Messages bluchez
dontwantaname wrote:You can say it here. You can start a thread in world of woot shirts and argue your point all you want.
I found the post in the thread for that shirt.
I have no problem with it being here.

As a mom I have a problem with fact you posted the comment back in the thread for the shirt when you knew it was a child.
The same post to an adult wouldn't have bothered me.



I am curious about this. I made a constructive post but referred to the artwork as childlike and critiqued the color choices, etc. Does this cross the new "please play nice in a kid's tshirt thread" boundary?

snarkygal


quality posts: 5 Private Messages snarkygal
dontwantaname wrote:The probation I've given out for general nastiness.
I'm sure there is an official way of phrasing it.
Woot would like to be a friendly, safe for work environment.



That is sooo vague. I truely believe personalities come into play into this. If a mod likes somebody, they get wider berth. General nastiness is not a rule. THIS PLACE IS GETTING SUCKIER BY THE MINUTE.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
dontwantaname wrote:What did it really have to do with the shirt?
Your complaint was it was a child.
The child didn't need to read it. You could say it here, you can start a thread, you can gripe directly to Joel.
That entire thread turned into a debate.

As a non artist, I liked the shirt. It had a childlike quality and it was drawn by a child, not an adult drawing badly.

There are plenty of poorly drawn shirts in the contest....go pick on those adults.



You realize "here" is where all the comments on the individual shirt pages go, right?

My complaint isn't that it's a child. There's another child shirt in this derby, but no one is voting for it. why? Because it's bad and done by a child. This one got a plug about being done by a kid, which got people voting for it. It is a bad design getting votes because it's a child. I don't mind that it's a bad design. I don't care who submits. But most poorly drawn shirts, at least this level of bad, don't get votes. This is, and only because it's done by a kid. I have no gripe with the kid or the mom. I have a gripe with the people who somehow think a shirt that they'd have passed by if it was by an adult is suddenly worth more from a kid. It's not. I am picking on adults. Adults who don't get what the derby's about. Adults who are, as I've said before, making more and more good artists avoid this site every week they do something like this. Get offended that I'm attacking your taste, not that I'm attacking a kid. The kid can't help it. Adults can.

Josephus


quality posts: 25 Private Messages Josephus
snarkygal wrote:That is sooo vague. I truely believe personalities come into play into this. If a mod likes somebody, they get wider berth. General nastiness is not a rule. THIS PLACE IS GETTING SUCKIER BY THE MINUTE.



A pretty strict rule they have is the one for "mod-baiting". That's a Gatzby rule, and is probation city.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
Josephus wrote:A pretty strict rule they have is the one for "mod-baiting". That's a Gatzby rule, and is probation city.



What happens when the mod is out of line? As I see it, this is actually a mod baiting people.

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

peppersabaddog wrote:you dont seem to understand that the comment thread and the individual shirt thread are the same thing.
also; friendly, i loled.
so we can only say nice things? i hope to god no one submits anything less than perfent from this point on, because no one is allowed to have a dissenting opinion of anything according to you and thats girraffe like... yeah i typed it out myself.... this isnt 1984 and people are allowed to voice opinions however they see fit, as long as it isnt breaking the REAL rules. you are not a god, nor are you my mother. having mod privlidges does not grant you supreme authority of my thoughts or anyone else's. if you want to be extreme in your discretionary rights do so with your own children, not with a forum of mainly adults. if a parent brings their child in these forums it should be with the knowledge that this is the internet for gods sake, not sesame street.



There are tons of reports for comments made on shirt that are out of line. Yes, you can get probation for that, especially when it turns into personal attacks.
I call them play nice probation's.

For goodness sakes, it is a young kid.
The shirt was colorful and not all that bad. Made me smile.
She shouldn't be reading all this stuff, but why post the entire debate about kids on her shirts thread?

The only probation's I've ever given out on shirt were for posts that people reported. Usually more than one person.


I posted my view on the thread for that one shirt. If those comments get posted here too....well I don't read the shirt threads, they are too long, so I didn't realize it. I was only talking about that one shirt.

I



WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
dontwantaname wrote:There are tons of reports for comments made on shirt that are out of line. Yes, you can get probation for that, espically when it turns into personal attacks.
I call them play nice probations.

For goodness sakes, it is a young kid.
The shirt was colorful and not all that bad. Made me smile.
She shouldn't be reading all this stuff, but why post the entire debate about kids on her shirts thread?

The only probations I've ever given out on shirt were for posts that people reported. Usually more than one person.


I posted my view on the thread for that one shirt. If those comments get posted here too....well I don't read the shirt threads, they are too long, so I didn't realize it. I was only talking about that one shirt.

I



You're arguing that your opinion is better than ours. Awesome.

Josephus


quality posts: 25 Private Messages Josephus
AdderXYU wrote:...

My complaint isn't that it's a child...



any more, I guess you mean, 'cause before, you were saying that kids shouldn't be allowed in the derby, just because they're kids:

AdderXYU wrote:Look, I know I'm going to catch a lot of flack for daring to criticize a child's entry, but there should not be child's entries in the derby...



AdderXYU wrote:...I can't see myself feeling bad to lose one artist talented beyond her years for the sake of blocking more of this sort of thing.

<<referring to Laura


From what I've seen in your comments, Adder, you just aren't sure what you think about this. On the one hand, at first, you were clearly stating that kids shouldn't be in the derby. But then you started talking about how you wouldn't mind kids being here if they were great, Threadless quality designers.

Now, you seem to be suggesting that it's the voters who ought to get their heads straight, and vote for the good designs, regardless of who entered them, and that you really don't have any bad feelings about this kid or her design at all, except that the doofus voters are voting for her design, and by doing so they are continuing the slide into awfulness that the derby is apparently on.

So, finally, at this point, I really have NO idea whether I agree with you or disagree with you. I think that the design and the comments posted by the mom and the designer caught on at first because it was just a sweet story, near the end of the derby, when most of the people who check out the forums had already voted for their favorites, and it got a little ride in the hotness. Then, you got a hold of it and boom! 70 votes or so! Probably the next entry she submits will be more down to earth in its votes, and this will all be forgotten.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
Josephus wrote:<<referring to Laura


From what I've seen in your comments, Adder, you just aren't sure what you think about this. On the one hand, at first, you were clearly stating that kids shouldn't be in the derby. But then you started talking about how you wouldn't mind kids being here if they were great, Threadless quality designers.

Now, you seem to be suggesting that it's the voters who ought to get their heads straight, and vote for the good designs, regardless of who entered them, and that you really don't have any bad feelings about this kid or her design at all, except that the doofus voters are voting for her design, and by doing so they are continuing the slide into awfulness that the derby is apparently on.

So, finally, at this point, I really have NO idea whether I agree with you or disagree with you. I think that the design and the comments posted by the mom and the designer caught on at first because it was just a sweet story, near the end of the derby, when most of the people who check out the forums had already voted for their favorites, and it got a little ride in the hotness. Then, you got a hold of it and boom! 70 votes or so! Probably the next entry she submits will be more down to earth in its votes, and this will all be forgotten.



I dont think any of those options is so bad. I see no reason to need bad designers, kid designers, or moron voters.

I hope you and Name enjoyed unloading your copious extra votes on this brilliant shirt, the sort of which we should cherish and wish for more of.
(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

snarkygal


quality posts: 5 Private Messages snarkygal
Josephus wrote:<<referring to Laura


From what I've seen in your comments, Adder, you just aren't sure what you think about this. On the one hand, at first, you were clearly stating that kids shouldn't be in the derby. But then you started talking about how you wouldn't mind kids being here if they were great, Threadless quality designers.

Now, you seem to be suggesting that it's the voters who ought to get their heads straight, and vote for the good designs, regardless of who entered them, and that you really don't have any bad feelings about this kid or her design at all, except that the doofus voters are voting for her design, and by doing so they are continuing the slide into awfulness that the derby is apparently on.

So, finally, at this point, I really have NO idea whether I agree with you or disagree with you. I think that the design and the comments posted by the mom and the designer caught on at first because it was just a sweet story, near the end of the derby, when most of the people who check out the forums had already voted for their favorites, and it got a little ride in the hotness. Then, you got a hold of it and boom! 70 votes or so! Probably the next entry she submits will be more down to earth in its votes, and this will all be forgotten.



Then why must you put yourself in this argument? It really didn't concern you at all.

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

snarkygal wrote:That is sooo vague. I truely believe personalities come into play into this. If a mod likes somebody, they get wider berth. General nastiness is not a rule. THIS PLACE IS GETTING SUCKIER BY THE MINUTE.



Oh, come on, it isn't that vague.
When there are 5 reports on the same post, or the same person, it isn't personal.


Yeah, this is just because the thread for a young child's shirt became a battleground or sorts.

I didn't deal with this with my kids. My kids grew up when there was only one computer in the house, so it wasn't an issue. My youngest is 21.

If it is bias that a mom would go defend a kid I don't know....well deal with it.
I was only talking about posts made in a shirt thread where we know a child made the shirt. Not the general world of shirtwoot.






WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

Josephus


quality posts: 25 Private Messages Josephus
snarkygal wrote:Then why must you put yourself in this argument? It really didn't concern you at all.



Oh, gee, maybe the fact that Adder was proposing that kids be banned? and that I have a 12 year old daughter that fairly often submits designs? Who belongs in this discussion if not me?

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

AdderXYU wrote:You realize "here" is where all the comments on the individual shirt pages go, right?

My complaint isn't that it's a child. There's another child shirt in this derby, but no one is voting for it. why? Because it's bad and done by a child. This one got a plug about being done by a kid, which got people voting for it. It is a bad design getting votes because it's a child. I don't mind that it's a bad design. I don't care who submits. But most poorly drawn shirts, at least this level of bad, don't get votes. This is, and only because it's done by a kid. I have no gripe with the kid or the mom. I have a gripe with the people who somehow think a shirt that they'd have passed by if it was by an adult is suddenly worth more from a kid. It's not. I am picking on adults. Adults who don't get what the derby's about. Adults who are, as I've said before, making more and more good artists avoid this site every week they do something like this. Get offended that I'm attacking your taste, not that I'm attacking a kid. The kid can't help it. Adults can.




Actually I didn't realize that the post went here too. But post here don't go there, unless woot is a mind reader and knows which shirt we are talking about.

Like I said, it bothered me that the posts were there, where the kid would read them.
Your posts would not be considered, by me, to be out of line if it wasn't a child.
Plus, just to get you guys more upset....I agree, a child should be allowed to read this large thread, so that is why I wouldn't care if the posts were just here.

I'm now going to check and see what is back in the shirt thread. If this post is there I am going to think the woot computer is named Hal!




WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

mosesallen


quality posts: 0 Private Messages mosesallen

I really want to buy this one!!! when will it be released from the fog???

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

dontwantaname wrote:Actually I didn't realize that the post went here too. But post here don't go there, unless woot is a mind reader and knows which shirt we are talking about.

Like I said, it bothered me that the posts were there, where the kid would read them.
Your posts would not be considered, by me, to be out of line if it wasn't a child.
Plus, just to get you guys more upset....I agree, a child should be allowed to read this large thread, so that is why I wouldn't care if the posts were just here.

I'm now going to check and see what is back in the shirt thread. If this post is there I am going to think the woot computer is named Hal!




Wow, it is.
How did they do that?

So, in the future, if it is a kid, ignore them and hope it doesn't win.


WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

mosesallen


quality posts: 0 Private Messages mosesallen


why was this rejected???

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
dontwantaname wrote:Wow, it is.
How did they do that?

So, in the future, if it is a kid, ignore them and hope it doesn't win.



This sounds like great advice. If a kid enters again, we should all ignore them and hope they don't win.

You go first

Josephus


quality posts: 25 Private Messages Josephus
AdderXYU wrote:I'd say your 12 year old daughter does. Unless you believe your work is more representative?



My 12 year old daughter is busy sleeping. She can certainly speak for herself, as she did earlier, but she has more important things to do right now. By the way, I would certainly not shield her from the comments made on woot, especially about her designs.I think the lessons she will learn from seeing the unvarnished harshness here will, in the long run, help her deal with life in high school and in adulthood. She is not going to grow up unaware of the real world, and in the context of things that she is personally involved in is a far better way for her to learn than being told about it.

I do think that everyone ought to be able to enter, especially her.
I also think that the voters, by and large, are poor at picking the best shirts. Of course, I think woot is also poor at picking the best shirts, so I don't see how taking it out of the voters' hands is really going to help much.

naterobnana


quality posts: 0 Private Messages naterobnana
Re: '88 Year Of The Dragon



My Grandson lives in Germany and all his friends are jealous over his cool woot shirts. I would love to add this to his collection. It makes me Nana of the year in his eyes.

bluchez


quality posts: 2 Private Messages bluchez
dontwantaname wrote:Wow, it is.
How did they do that?

So, in the future, if it is a kid, ignore them and hope it doesn't win.



Just for the record, I lied about my birth year in my designs. I'm actually 9. Finally, noone is allowed to criticize me. MUHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAA

naterobnana


quality posts: 0 Private Messages naterobnana
Re: 1988 year of the dragon



Beautiful mythicaly mysterious.

Josephus


quality posts: 25 Private Messages Josephus
bluchez wrote:Just for the record, I lied about my birth year in my designs. I'm actually 9. Finally, noone is allowed to criticize me. MUHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAA



well, except Adder. ;^)

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
Josephus wrote:

I do think that everyone ought to be able to enter, especially her.
I also think that the voters, by and large, are poor at picking the best shirts. Of course, I think woot is also poor at picking the best shirts, so I don't see how taking it out of the voters' hands is really going to help much.



For the umpteenth time, woot picks bad shirts largely because they can't get most good designers to offload good designs. Know why? Because woot's derbies are jokes.

I'd love it if someone like jimiyo, or someone else who has had extensive experience with real designers, could back me up on this. It just seems so obvious.

Josephus


quality posts: 25 Private Messages Josephus
AdderXYU wrote:For the umpteenth time, woot picks bad shirts largely because they can't get most good designers to offload good designs. Know why? Because woot's derbies are jokes.

I'd love it if someone like jimiyo, or someone else who has had extensive experience with real designers, could back me up on this. It just seems so obvious.



We agree completely.

naterobnana


quality posts: 0 Private Messages naterobnana
Re: [url=http://shirt.woot.com/Derby/Entry.aspx?id=13068]1948 GOODBY BIG BANDS - HELLO ROCK



Love both types of music, so the morfing from one into the other is fine with me. PS I've got ya by 2 years and lovin' every minute of it!

eHalcyon


quality posts: 66 Private Messages eHalcyon

I don't believe that a child's submission receiving some votes will drive away good designers. Even when bad designs get put up for sale, I don't think most designers will be put off by that, though it may seem a bit discouraging. I think that the biggest problem new designers have with woot is the environment. It's threads like this that drive away new talent.

Adder, you made the comment that this design is unwearable. I thus find this comment of yours quite hypocritical:


AdderXYU wrote:You're arguing that your opinion is better than ours. Awesome.




Your suggestion that this design is unwearable is an OPINION. Frankly, I agree - I wouldn't wear this. But everyone has different tastes - Adder, who are you to say that other people can't vote for this if they want to? You are assuming that all the votes were made in pity.

Some people voted on this because it was designed by a 10 year old - I disagree with this because I think designs should be judged by their merit alone, independent of the designer. Some people voted on this because of the senseless argument this thread has degenerated into - I disagree with this too because it serves no purpose but to underscore that democracy doesn't always work. I am also positive that some people voted for this design simply because they liked it, would buy it, and would wear it.

This was a child's submission. It was sent in for kicks, and I doubt that there was any expectation of it winning. What was the point in filling this thread with nasty comments and bitter insults? Adder, you stated your feelings on the matter. All was well and good. Some people disagreed with you. Everything was still fine. And then everything snowballed and nobody was willing to just stop and say "we disagree. Oh well."

To that end, I think that it's wonderful how so many people here have stepped up to defend the young designer. But honestly, all you're doing is perpetuating an argument that will never end. These shirt comment threads are supposed to be for encouragement, praise and constructive criticism, and maybe the ocassional pithy joke. Instead, your combined vehemence has turned this thread into an ugly pit of insults and slander. I've seen Adder spew out his fair share of unwarranted drivel, but he hasn't been alone in that.

On the comments by dontwantaname - I understand that you feel that comments such as these shouldn't be on a kid's shirt, but I think it would be wrong to give this design special treatment simply because the artwork is a child's. This is a contest and, as long as submissions follow the rules, everyone is elligible and everyone is equal, in opportunity if not in skill.

That said, I feel that certain comments here have stepped across the line. I don't know if anybody deserves to be put on probation or if any comments should be deleted. I just think that these comments should be treated the same as comments on any other shirt. It is unfortunate that the kid can't read comments on her shirt without them being filtered by her mom, but given this community, that is how it should be. This design should be treated as any other design, regardless of the age of the designer. Comments should be treated the same as well, regardless of the shirt on which the comments are made.


And I'll reiterate my comment on this:

AdderXYU wrote:For the umpteenth time, woot picks bad shirts largely because they can't get most good designers to offload good designs. Know why? Because woot's derbies are jokes.

I'd love it if someone like jimiyo, or someone else who has had extensive experience with real designers, could back me up on this. It just seems so obvious.



The derbies may be part of the problem, but so are the ridiculous flame wars that crop up here. If someone makes a tiny submission error or accidentally breaks a rule, it seems like everyone is jumping down their throat. Again - THIS was a child's submission made and submitted for fun. You've turned it into a circus. In any case, what does the derby have to do with daily submissions?

Anyway, it's probably too much to hope for, but could everyone just close their eyes, take a big deep breath and let this whole mess go?

(Unofficial) Derby Rules (outdated?)
Designing for the Derby (definitely outdated)
Tips for New Designers (always useful)

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

AdderXYU wrote:This sounds like great advice. If a kid enters again, we should all ignore them and hope they don't win.

You go first




Since all the post go back to the original shirt thread, the parents are responsible to make sure the kid doesn't see it.

But since you know that, why start? Give the kid some tips and move on.

If the kid wins, blame it on the voting. We have voted in some bad shirts in the past.

Just remember, if we are sure it is a child, be gentle. I'm talking young kids....most of the teenagers can take care of themselves.

Now go argue with yourselves. I have two rats looking at me because they know they get fed at 1am and it is 1:30 now.
Wait till they find out there is nothing exciting tonight. Just some uncooked oatmeal , a grape and a baby carrot.


Every comment gets dumped into one thread? That is nuts.

WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

sentnl


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sentnl
Re: 1988, The Human Genome Project



Ah! So close to the end, this shirt better get top three. I need one. Cmon, vote people!

dontwantaname


quality posts: 13 Private Messages dontwantaname

Volunteer Moderator

eHalcyon wrote:I don't believe that a child's submission receiving some votes will drive away good designers. Even when bad designs get put up for sale, I don't think most designers will be put off by that, though it may seem a bit discouraging. I think that the biggest problem new designers have with woot is the environment. It's threads like this that drive away new talent.

Adder, you made the comment that this design is unwearable. I thus find this comment of yours quite hypocritical:




The derbies may be part of the problem, but so are the ridiculous flame wars that crop up here. If someone makes a tiny submission error or accidentally breaks a rule, it seems like everyone is jumping down their throat. Again - THIS was a child's submission made and submitted for fun. You've turned it into a circus. In any case, what does the derby have to do with daily submissions?

Anyway, it's probably too much to hope for, but could everyone just close their eyes, take a big deep breath and let this whole mess go?



Watch out, if you make that much sense, they might ask you to be a mod!

eHalcyon is right.
Now everyone give up and go to sleep!

WE LURV YOU TOO! Dork!!!
No greater love is lost than that not shared.

peppersabaddog


quality posts: 1 Private Messages peppersabaddog
dontwantaname wrote:Watch out, if you make that much sense, they might ask you to be a mod!

eHalcyon is right.
Now everyone give up and go to sleep!





strange, its the same thing i said, only nicer.


just remember people:
the people that vote for woot shirts vote for president too.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
eHalcyon wrote:I don't believe that a child's submission receiving some votes will drive away good designers. Even when bad designs get put up for sale, I don't think most designers will be put off by that, though it may seem a bit discouraging. I think that the biggest problem new designers have with woot is the environment. It's threads like this that drive away new talent.



then you are wrong.

Adder, you made the comment that this design is unwearable. I thus find this comment of yours quite hypocritical:



I'm not a mod threatening probations for disagreeing with my opinion. DWAN is. Which I still feel is a pretty poor stance for a mod to take.

The derbies may be part of the problem, but so are the ridiculous flame wars that crop up here. If someone makes a tiny submission error or accidentally breaks a rule, it seems like everyone is jumping down their throat.



If you cannot read a contest's rules before entering it, you deserve this. Simple reading. Even the 10 year old followed the submission guidelines.

In any case, what does the derby have to do with daily submissions?



Derby success gives potential designers an idea of what woot is looking for. If they send in dailies, they will most often be dailies that fit the woot mold... something mediocre, something skully or memey, etc. These artists don't enter derbies because they don't want to waste the time against a tasteless crowd. They give their worst work day after day because they don't want to waste a killer one on a site where their work won't even exist more than a week. They submit designs that failed elsewhere because they know woot will take anything. People voting for such mediocre work leads designers to work just that hard when submitting to woot. It leads plenty of good designers to take derby breaks out of frustration. These are real issues in this site. So is the reaction from a MODERATOR. Mods with that kind of partiality are not healthy for a community... it just makes people too scared to be themselves. Even one stupid little derby shirt can pull up the dark, disgusting underbelly, and thats why we need to be vigilant. Again, woot themselves have begged us to police the derbies ourselves. If I'm one of the few willing to do that, and I'm constantly harassed for it, that's fine.

Anyway, it's probably too much to hope for, but could everyone just close their eyes, take a big deep breath and let this whole mess go?



this line doesn't work if you've just made a huge post trying to have the last word.

RicardoRizo


quality posts: 0 Private Messages RicardoRizo
Re: 1982: Thriller



Please, please, please! I can't vote for this one more than once. I want it to be in the fog. Pleeeease vote for it. I love it!

jimiyo


quality posts: 2 Private Messages jimiyo
AdderXYU wrote:For the umpteenth time, woot picks bad shirts largely because they can't get most good designers to offload good designs. Know why? Because woot's derbies are jokes.

I'd love it if someone like jimiyo, or someone else who has had extensive experience with real designers, could back me up on this. It just seems so obvious.



Woot derbies are hit and miss. I suppose if I were to politik, and consistently submit, I would eventually start winning derbies often, but Im not particular to how the woot audience treats good artist. They seem to have a love hate relationship with them. In a second they seem to turn on you. Ive seen Cho's work get criticized or some sassy chimpanzee come in and threadcrap.. it seemed to happen every week. Of course he wins, cause there still enough people who admire his work, but I have to tell you, I only got a little bit of it, and I was amazed at how disdainful the woot audience is, and how discouraging it is.

I get the feeling theres a bunch of trolls that are allowed to plunder around and be meanies without any sort of punishment.

After I stopped submitting I made some small comment about how I didnt like someones shoddy ceiling cat,

(cause we all know... Ceiling Cat should be done with the utmost quality so's not to anger him, he's up there, waiting if you anger him, to use his sharp claws, and you know when hes looking down at you... that wouldnt be a good time for him to extract revenge.)

and someone, wait no, ExpletiveDeleted, called me a jerk. Sup with that? So other people can go around and be meanies but Im held to a higher standard?

Really, I just needed to step back from the Derby cause it was too time consuming for the payout and abuse. But $1000 aint bad...

But I dont understand the quality of the Dailies. Woot cant be getting that many crappy designs for them not to be able to choose something awesome. I dunno. $1000 aint bad for doing almost WHATEVER you want to do...

Erm... apparently theres some mentally infatuated kid who was helped by his parents to submit a design? I havent read all the details... That's cool... I mean, just as long as it doesnt win, unless its some killer crazy ass autistic kid who can draw a mean Joe Perry ripping up on a guitar, or a David Lee Roth like kicking up in the air like in Jump video! now THAT... done by an austitic kid would rOCK the House and should win.

But then you know if he kept on coming back and winning, eventually they would turn on him too. Call him infatuated or something.

But the first few wins, let the giraffe win a few.

Woot audience will turn. I guarantee.

tjballew


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tjballew
keyser520 wrote:As far as I know, it's not. It wasn't used as the logo for the movie. It's simply used as something worn in the movie and something on the book in the movie. It isn't even on my own personal copy of the book.

if I am wrong, please correct me. i was planning to put this on spreadshirt or cafepress if it didn't win here... but I can't do that if it's copyrighted.



what kind of shirts does cafepress print on?

lingo654


quality posts: 0 Private Messages lingo654
Re: 1985 - Buckminsterfullerene (super geek version)



I just wanted to congratulate you on making it to the fog. When i first voted for the shirt i didn't think it would make it. Not because it was a bad design, i just didn't think people liked orgo. I guess i underestimated the number of science nerds on woot .

This is great. I love this shirt and i hope i can buy one. Way to go!

eHalcyon


quality posts: 66 Private Messages eHalcyon
AdderXYU wrote:then you are wrong.



Yeah, thanks for letting others have opinions. You seem to think that your opinion is a fact. How could you possibly know how many designers have taken a look at these sorts of comments and just thought to themselves "no thanks" and walked away?


I'm not a mod threatening probations for disagreeing with my opinion. DWAN is. Which I still feel is a pretty poor stance for a mod to take.



Okay, perhaps I missed it, but I never saw a comment like that. She wasn't against your difference of opinion - she was against the inflammatory and unduly harsh delivery of that opinion. And that doesn't change the hypocrisy of that comment of yours. The fact that you're not a mod doesn't make it ok to be hypocritical.


If you cannot read a contest's rules before entering it, you deserve this. Simple reading. Even the 10 year old followed the submission guidelines.



It doesn't mean you have to be rude about it. Is civility really such an undesirable trait to you? The problem with being a jerk to everyone who makes a stupid mistake is that you end up being a jerk to those who make legitimate mistakes, i.e. if someone absolutely new reads the official rules and submits a flying penguin design. The banning of flying penguins is not mentioned on any official page - it's a legitimate mistake. But if people continually act in an elitist manner, they start to treat new people with contempt.


Derby success gives potential designers an idea of what woot is looking for. If they send in dailies, they will most often be dailies that fit the woot mold... something mediocre, something skully or memey, etc. These artists don't enter derbies because they don't want to waste the time against a tasteless crowd. They give their worst work day after day because they don't want to waste a killer one on a site where their work won't even exist more than a week. They submit designs that failed elsewhere because they know woot will take anything. People voting for such mediocre work leads designers to work just that hard when submitting to woot. It leads plenty of good designers to take derby breaks out of frustration.



For every mediocre piece that has been put on sale, I've seen another that is creative, fresh and well-executed. Most of the top selling shirts are examples. If you disagree with that, it's fine, but your opinion is worth no more than my own or that of anybody else on this site. If potential designers decide to submit their worst as a daily, I would blame that on the designers rather than the derbies. The majority of unpopular daily submissions I've seen do not compare in the slightest to derby winners.


These are real issues in this site. So is the reaction from a MODERATOR. Mods with that kind of partiality are not healthy for a community... it just makes people too scared to be themselves.



I've already commented on DWAN's reaction and her suggestion that a kid's shirt be given less severe comments than others'. I agreed with you. But although she showed some partiality, it doesn't make the worst of these comments any less probation-worthy.


Even one stupid little derby shirt can pull up the dark, disgusting underbelly, and thats why we need to be vigilant.



My point exactly. This design was one little derby shirt, but everyone is just raging and flaming and going on and on. I'm no better - here I am responding to you, and doubtless I will receive another lengthy reply, and the cycle I tried to end will go on and on simply because I don't want my opinion misrepresented - and you probably feel the same way.

Adder, I feel that you made some very strong points. But your less-than-cordial manner and outright verbal abuse of people undermines your arguments! I find myself arguing against you when I actually agreed with most of your initial comments. Please, continue shining your light on all the little problems with woot and the derbies and the submissions and the people, but do it without pulling up that dark, disgusting underbelly of yours. You can continue being the crusader you are without offending everyone in sight - just offend most of them!


Again, woot themselves have begged us to police the derbies ourselves. If I'm one of the few willing to do that, and I'm constantly harassed for it, that's fine.



Woot may have asked the users to police the derbies, but they did not ask us to form militias or angry mobs. They didn't ask us to hurl insults at each other, start little wars or make mountains out of molehills, as has been done with this shirt designed by a young girl. Plenty of people are policing the derbies - the evidence is right here in this thread. Many people - I included - have been trying to step in and end this farce. Unfortunately, we all have simply been dragged into it, further escalating the problem. And I am sorry if you feel harassed, but nothing said against you has been any worse than the comments you yourself have made. Many of the most harassing comments I've read have been yours, actually.


this line doesn't work if you've just made a huge post trying to have the last word.



You think the worst of me. I wasn't trying to get the last word in, Adder. I was trying to mediate. Sorry, I'm a stereotypical Canadian like that. I was trying to show that both sides had valid points and that this whole thread exploded because nobody was willing to just stop and take the high road.

I was trying to be impartial. If it seemed like I was focusing on you, I apologize - you're just one of the most vocal (which isn't necessarily a bad thing). But surely you must admit that this has gotten out of hand, and almost everyone who has participated in this conversation has played a part in it.

Edit: I read over my replies and some of them seem a bit harsh to me. I apologize for any undue snappiness - it's late and I wrote two final exams today.




jimiyo wrote:...Im not particular to how the woot audience treats good artist...
...I was amazed at how disdainful the woot audience is, and how discouraging it is.

I get the feeling theres a bunch of trolls that are allowed to plunder around and be bitches without any sort of punishment...

...Really, I just needed to step back from the Derby cause it was too time consuming for the payout and abuse...



It sounds to me like the woot audience is simply too harsh, both to designers and to others who are commenting. Like in this thread - if you read the beginning of this fiasco, Adder was perfectly civil. In fact, there was good dialog, good discussion. Then somebody criticized Adder for his opinion, and he defended himself in a similarly critical manner, and everyone went bananas.


and someone, wait no, ExpletiveDeleted, called me a jerk. Sup with that? So other people can go around and be bitches but Im held to a higher standard?



I think it's because you're so great and mighty that you need to set a proper example for the rest of us. And also, some people don't have a sense of humour. It's a serious medical condition.


But I dont understand the quality of the Dailies. Woot cant be getting that many crappy designs for them not to be able to choose something awesome. I dunno. $1000 aint bad for doing almost WHATEVER you want to do...



I have a question about that, actually. Does woot actually require that you have an extensive profile before choosing your daily? From the FAQ, I got the sense that only experienced designers could apply, and then woot would look at the designer's profile. If they liked what they saw, they would contact the designer, who would then design a daily. However, this seems contrary to what I've picked up from the general community. Can amateurs submit designs as dailies, or is it just that artists can apply and, if they are lucky enough, get commissioned to create a daily?

I'll see if I get an answer here, but if the question gets buried in an avalanche of diatribe and rhetoric I'll repost it later in a more appropriate forum.

(Unofficial) Derby Rules (outdated?)
Designing for the Derby (definitely outdated)
Tips for New Designers (always useful)

llcooljunr


quality posts: 0 Private Messages llcooljunr
Re: 1992 - The Arrival of New Age Break Dancing



If you rotate it to the left, it kinda looks like the Jumpman.

This is how we chill from 93 till...