Shirt.Woot

MrMalletman wrote:Must... have... this... shirt...

This may be the only shirt to miss out on printing for which I've actually waited eagerly for the second take.

It's just too fun twisting a childhood story into something rather morbid. Kind of like the original versions of fairy tales, pre-Disney.

Agreed, agreed, and agreed.

kylemittskus wrote:Bink,

I've been pretty apathetic towards you, neither liking nor disliking you personally (from what you post, of course).Your work is not my style whatsoever, but that is not important. I, however, am no longer apathetic towards you, and I think that you are being intentionally insulting for no apparent reason. Like Adder, I didn't take the second statement about hypocrisy as a joke. The first one, I did. I happen to agree with most of Adder's comments, even if I don't agree with his methodology. Perhaps he shouldn't insult people, but he does so for a specific purpose beyond being an ass.

I'll second this comment. Bink, I actually do quite like the way you present yourself in the forums. Most of the time you're very nice, helpful and courteous. But it seems to me like you just wanted to provoke Adder over a rather innocuous comment. And while your initial response may have been in jest, the bulk of it really didn't appear that way.

chade2001 wrote: To me, I could care less what the artists have designed in the past because they tend to get better (or worse). All I have to look at is what they have now in front of me. So the opposite of what you said is true, a person who judge a current work by the artist and his/her past work is the "short-sighted and foolish" one.

Agreed. I was responding to Bink's statement that there were many artists with a style similar to Edgar's. My point was that I don't think she has been around long enough to judge what Edgar's style is, thus making her statement narrow-sighted due to her lack of prolonged exposure (that sounds pejorative, but I shall keep it because it sounds medical, making it completely random in the context).

Re: Panda loves ballet

coool crayon style

kylemittskus wrote:Agreed. I was responding to Bink's statement that there were many artists with a style similar to Edgar's. My point was that I don't think she has been around long enough to judge what Edgar's style is, thus making her statement narrow-sighted due to her lack of prolonged exposure (that sounds pejorative, but I shall keep it because it sounds medical, making it completely random in the context).

Aha!

Case closed!

chade2001 wrote:Aha!

Case closed!

And well argued, reasoned, and discussed by both parties. Cheers!

Love this shirt. If it doesn't print this time around, I'm going to become Death and destroy the world.

chade2001 wrote:Kylemittkus,

A design should not be judged because of the artist nor because of his/her past work. It should be judged because of its sheer awesomeness at any given derby.

...

Edgar's work is something I always look forward to because it's a complete standout, not just from his past work, but from the derby as well.

Thought you might be interested to see that side by side.

I don't care for the Mona Lisa, but I understand why people do, and would be offended for the late mr. davinci if someone ever said "man, kdeuce, your splatters are as evocative and mysterious as the mona lisa".

Sometimes, you appreciate work for what it is regardless of whether it is for you. I rarely want a Drakxxx shirt, but i sure as hell can appreciate his linework and detail. What is happening here is simply people stating "I cannot grasp what this is, because it is not an internet meme or a familiar style. It must be horrible."

Re: People of the Sun (final)

Arrgghh! For the second time my desire for this shirt is being denied by voters! Vote it up, mes amis!

AdderXYU wrote:Thought you might be interested to see that side by side.

It is interesting. It's like I'm waiting for him to submit a not so great design.

Re: Acherontia lachesis IIIx

I can't express how much I love this design.

Andy47240 wrote:I can't express how much I love this design.

Thanks, Andy. I'm rather fond of how this version came out with the halftoning. It radiates energy and pops off the shirt.

kdubbs29 wrote:My comment did not come across as intended. I simply meant that I personally would have doubted myself and the shirt's success if I had come up with this idea. I second-guess many of my ideas (and probably with good reason). I wasn't making a comment saying that person X would have success submitting this design while person Y wouldn't. It was more a comment about my own thoughts when I draw ideas. I've had several ideas that I scrapped part way through because I figure it would never get votes.

I know what you mean, and have done the exact same thing several times. But, I've also submitted a lot of designs that personally I liked and/or made me laugh. Even if I'm skeptical about how the woot crowd will take it, I still enter them. Most of the time they flop and I'll get less than fifty votes; every once in awhile though one hits with the crowd and does well. I've entered the shirt.woot derby nearly ninety weeks and haven't ended in the fog once. Even if they don't print, it's still worthwhile to me.

kylemittskus,

I understand your concerns, and I had a feeling that my words could be misinterpreted, as forum conversations are so difficult to have. So, to hopefully provide a clearer understanding of my points of view, I'll tell you these things:

I have absolutely nothing against Edgar or his work. If people like it, that's great! I like some of his pieces too! ...just not all that I've seen. I respect him as an artist just as I try to respect everyone else that enters their creations in these derbies. I have just seen a lot of work somewhat similar to his style, but that surely doesn't mean that other people aren't allowed to like it, even if they too have seen similar styles. (Also, I would send you links but I don't currently watch any of those artists on deviant art. Most of what I've seen is in casual browsing or by referral or similar instances.)

Everything I said really had nothing to do with Edgar at all. It was all about Adder, and I was merely surprised that someone who critiques designs so harshly (regarding technical execution, creativity, clear concept, placement, humor, whatever it may be) would fancy work similar to Edgar's. Now, what I said just there is not a negative comment toward Edgar, I just mean that his work sometimes is difficult to decipher regarding meaning, or it is sketchily or more abstractly done. Sometimes it can too come off as a more childish and whimsical style, a subject of which Adder has many times spoken negatively, as he seems to just despise childish designs.

SOooooo having said all that, I hope you can understand that "Edgar" could have been replaced in any or all of my posts with any other artist with a similar style, as I was merely using his work as a comparison to further explain my hypocrisy comment. I think if you knew me beyond these forums you'd probably get what I was saying a little bit better, and you'd know that I'm really one of those people that prefers to support other artists when it comes to their work rather than beat them down. I think I came across as just totally bashing Edgar, but that wasn't what I meant at all. Edgar, if you're reading this - I'm so sorry for coming across that way.

As for Adder though, his personality and how he chooses to convey himself bothers me a bit, and that's what I was mainly addressing. While I don't like the way he speaks, I would never make fun of his art, nor would I bash him down either for creating something if he enjoys doing it.

If you still are concerned or confused or anything, please tell me. I'd much rather straighten this up, explain myself, and hear how you feel about all of this rather than let it go on and have us all feeling animosity toward each other. Feel free to send me a private message or post here, whatever will work best.

eHalcyon wrote:I'll second this comment. Bink, I actually do quite like the way you present yourself in the forums. Most of the time you're very nice, helpful and courteous. But it seems to me like you just wanted to provoke Adder over a rather innocuous comment. And while your initial response may have been in jest, the bulk of it really didn't appear that way.

Well yes the first part was a joke, and the second as I explained was poking fun at Adder, of course trying to provoke him, because that's what he does non-stop to everyone else. I was just throwing back at him what he does so often, and many times with people as aggressive and negative as he, I enjoy challenging them. However, I don't understand why everyone is acting so oddly to my comment that I think Adder is somewhat hypocritical at times. People have said much worse things to him, and rarely does anyone stop them and say "hey now - that's a little insulting". People rarely stop Adder either, when he slings insults and chooses such harsh words, so why now are a few of you all trying to sensor me?

Re: People of the Sun (final)

Immense love for this one. Voted again.

kdubbs29 wrote:It is an absolute shame this isn't doing better. I think this is one of the best designs in the whole competition. It is complex in its design, yet so simple in its message. Brilliant!

Ditto. Please consider printing this at cameesa or the like if it doesn't make it this week. I would buy several copies of this, so I can promise you support if you do. Good luck!

Re: Birdplanes!

There's such a spirit of adventure in this picture. I love it. Most definitely voted again.

Re: I am become death, the destroyer of worlds.

Since it first appeared, I liked this drawing but not as a shirt, and I just realized why: Three Wolf Moon. Although I don't think this design itself is tacky, it really reminds me of those very tacky semi-tie-dyed big-animal-design t-shirts.

Anyway, sorry it sounds like I'm hating on the design, I really would like it a lot on anything but a t-shirt. Good luck to all those who want this, maybe I'll get lucky and they'll print Rain Dancer too.

jmmbell1987 wrote:That's a selling point of this shirt, no? Food stains will blend right in!

Mmmm.

Re: Calling John Henry!

Re: Taj Mahal

you should print up a bunch and take them to india and sell them as tourist shirts... good image.

binkdrop wrote:However, I don't understand why everyone is acting so oddly to my comment that I think Adder is somewhat hypocritical at times. People have said much worse things to him, and rarely does anyone stop them and say "hey now - that's a little insulting". People rarely stop Adder either, when he slings insults and chooses such harsh words, so why now are a few of you all trying to sensor me?

Here's why, at least for me. First of all, like I said, I may not approve of Adder's methodology. However, I strongly agree with his purpose. His insults, caustic critiques, and scathing words are for a specific and intended purpose. I think, although I would not speak for him, that Adder REALLY cares about the shirt world. His blog is very well done and he says things out of care. Again, I think he desires shirt.woot and I do too. The DBH and Threadless stuff is often times pretty damn awesome, but rather expensive. If we could get that quality at woot, total win. So, the difference I see between Adder's insults at others and your insults at Adder is that his has a purpose while yours was merely selfish and obstinate.

The hypocrite comment is offensive for the same reason. If nothing else, Adder is consistent. I have seen him call out TGentry (an artist he, along with me and many others, greatly appreciate), and I know he has called out other artists he has at other times praised, but I can't think of them off the top of my head. In my opinion, that is laudable and the exact opposite of hypocrisy. My intent is not to defend Adder as much as it is to defend the proverbial "necessary evil." Someone needs to call shirt.woot out (and other sites) when they do stupid stuff, and that voice needs to be educated in what they are talking about. If nothing else, Adder is educated in the world of shirt art. I also happen to think that a lot of times, he is able to deconstruct bad arguments which is something I enjoy doing too, so that's fun for me. Someone needs to call people out and they are never liked, but are often times -- although certainly not always -- correct.

On another note, I was rather surprised to see the comments come from you. You seemed to me to be emerging as an eHalcyon (yeah, I'm going to call your ass out!) kind of poster. He maintains balance between people like Adder and sometimes myself. I am not anywhere near as knowledgeable about this world as Adder is, but I somehow find myself getting probation rather often anyway. eHal may not always agree with Adder and he may not always agree with the people who post against Adder saying completely pointless things, but he is never insulting and always responds maturely, much like you did last week I think when someone made some stupid ass comment to me.

Again, loquaciousness abounds. Nevertheless, there you have it.

goodedesign wrote:you should print up a bunch and take them to india and sell them as tourist shirts... good image.

Why would Indians buy a shirt of something that they have in their own country? That would be like a New Yorker wearing an "I Love New York" shirt.

binkdrop wrote:Well yes the first part was a joke, and the second as I explained was poking fun at Adder, of course trying to provoke him, because that's what he does non-stop to everyone else. I was just throwing back at him what he does so often, and many times with people as aggressive and negative as he, I enjoy challenging them. However, I don't understand why everyone is acting so oddly to my comment that I think Adder is somewhat hypocritical at times. People have said much worse things to him, and rarely does anyone stop them and say "hey now - that's a little insulting". People rarely stop Adder either, when he slings insults and chooses such harsh words, so why now are a few of you all trying to sensor me?

No one is trying to censor you, they are just disagreeing, because you claimed that Adder was being hypocritical without any explanation. Although you have now given an explanation, I don't consider you any less wrong than before. You believe he is hypocritical for supporting edgar's work when you have seen him bash designs that you consider similar to edgar's. However, your initial accusation of hypocrisy was in direct response to a post of Adder's explaining exactly what he feels differentiates edgar's work.

You then go on to call him argumentative, when it was actually you trying to provoke him, as you admit. You claim it is not worth "having long and drawn out conversations with [him] about nothing" in the first long-winded post of this page. You accuse him of slinging insults and dare him to be a jerk to you, right after accusing him of having a "man-crush" and getting his "panties all in a twist."

Is Adder the nicest guy on the forum? Hell no. But for hypocritical, you might want to read your own posts.

binkdrop wrote:Well yes the first part was a joke, and the second as I explained was poking fun at Adder, of course trying to provoke him, because that's what he does non-stop to everyone else. I was just throwing back at him what he does so often, and many times with people as aggressive and negative as he, I enjoy challenging them. However, I don't understand why everyone is acting so oddly to my comment that I think Adder is somewhat hypocritical at times. People have said much worse things to him, and rarely does anyone stop them and say "hey now - that's a little insulting". People rarely stop Adder either, when he slings insults and chooses such harsh words, so why now are a few of you all trying to sensor me?

Ha, I refer you to the thread for Ramy's most recent print. I think it starts around the last two pages.

I wasn't trying to censor you; I was merely remarking that the particular comment by Adder that you responded to seemed quite innocent, especially compared to some of the other stuff he's posted. If you want to make a comment about those things he says, it would be more effective to reply to one of those instead of one where he was just praising Edgar. Hopefully you can see why that seemed a bit out of the blue!

kylemittskus wrote:On another note, I was rather surprised to see the comments come from you. You seemed to me to be emerging as an eHalcyon (yeah, I'm going to call your ass out!) kind of poster. He maintains balance between people like Adder and sometimes myself. I am not anywhere near as knowledgeable about this world as Adder is, but I somehow find myself getting probation rather often anyway. eHal may not always agree with Adder and he may not always agree with the people who post against Adder saying completely pointless things, but he is never insulting and always responds maturely, much like you did last week I think when someone made some stupid ass comment to me.

Again, loquaciousness abounds. Nevertheless, there you have it.

I feel all warm and tingly inside now, sir Mittskus.

eHalcyon wrote:So is the pink-ish part an orange halftone? Or is the black the same dark blue as the darker halftones in the clouds?

I don't doubt that only six colours are used (I'm not always a fan of his pieces but Edgar definitely knows what he's doing). I'm curious as to which colours were actually used though. The watercolour effect is great.

I'm pretty sure that the pink-ish color around the sun is indeed an orange halftone. At first I thought that the gray/dark-blue of the clouds might be the same as the outlines (since it seems like it might have been a good way to conserve colors), but the outlines appear to be just plain black. I think.

Re: Ambitious Air Horn

I remember seeing this shirt and loving it. I just hate the lemon color. Nevertheless, nice shirt. For some reason, I think it's hilarious.

eHalcyon wrote:I feel all warm and tingly inside now, sir Mittskus.

Shut up and get back to moderating!

Re: Some BBQ

Consider my $10 yours shirt.woot!

itoaseik wrote:I'm pretty sure that the pink-ish color around the sun is indeed an orange halftone. At first I thought that the gray/dark-blue of the clouds might be the same as the outlines (since it seems like it might have been a good way to conserve colors), but the outlines appear to be just plain black. I think.

I see gray, although maybe not the same one as the clouds.

jasneko wrote:You can still get dancing keys - take some lessons or join a group... good way to meet ladies, or at least get some skills;) In college the ballroom club meetings were 25 females to 1 males...the guys became studs! And that's how one guy wooed one of my friends... and they're still together: )

Hah! I've been actually trying to convince my friends to take that ballroom dance class with me at the community college. That and their cooking classes. I guess I'll have to be more persuasive. It's always good to know a couple dance steps or two. You never know when somebody challenges you to a dance off, so you can defend yourself with the seductive and fiery salsa!

This conversation went in a direction I never intended it to go. I thought this would we a wonderful place for me to make some friends, share some good discussion, and grow with other artists, but I don't believe that is entirely true now. Perhaps I misspoke with my previous post, chose my words poorly, and and came off in a tone that wasn't quite what I wanted to convey. Perhaps it's even possible that I've misinterpreted some of everyone's responses, and you didn't mean to come at me so harshly.

Either way, I just wanted to let you all know that you succeeded in hurting my feelings - quite a bit actually. I think the best move for me now is to just disassociate myself from these forums. My happiness isn't worth trying to be friends with you guys.

Good luck to all designers with your entries. : )

Chaosegg wrote:Yeah, why aren't there cannons if it's a corsair with a pirate flag? ;)

They're hidden in there with the portholes. ;)

binkdrop wrote:This conversation went in a direction I never intended it to go. I thought this would we a wonderful place for me to make some friends, share some good discussion, and grow with other artists, but I don't believe that is entirely true now. Perhaps I misspoke with my previous post, chose my words poorly, and and came off in a tone that wasn't quite what I wanted to convey. Perhaps it's even possible that I've misinterpreted some of everyone's responses, and you didn't mean to come at me so harshly.

Either way, I just wanted to let you all know that you succeeded in hurting my feelings - quite a bit actually. I think the best move for me now is to just disassociate myself from these forums. My happiness isn't worth trying to be friends with you guys.

Good luck to all designers with your entries. : )

Good job guys. Now she got hurt feelings. Well, you still got an e-friend in me and in others as well I bet. Just forgive and forget. Live and learn. Or whatever hackneyed saying that goes along this, hehe. Just don't let something like this ruin a (hopefully) promising experience here on shirt.woot! Woop!

binkdrop wrote:
Everything I said really had nothing to do with Edgar at all. It was all about Adder, and I was merely surprised that someone who critiques designs so harshly (regarding technical execution, creativity, clear concept, placement, humor, whatever it may be) would fancy work similar to Edgar's. Now, what I said just there is not a negative comment toward Edgar

BS. It is hurtful towards Edgar. It is exactly why I said my web 2.0 statement. I didn't even use your name, I stated a generalized taste, but you took offense and saw it as a personal attack against your work.

You say right up there that Edgar's style isn't worthy of high artistic praise because its childlike and hard to understand. You use his name directly, it's demeaning, and your comments were not only directed towards adder.

Re: Some BBQ

One of the best shirts ever. Really hope it prints this time around. Think they will do EC's next weekend during the bag derby since I don't think they will sell 1st, 2nd and 3rd bags? (unless they print them as T's)

Re: He's developing a nasty tan

This is hilarious! Deserves more votes.

Re: Bunny Holly

nicely done! I like it.

kylemittskus wrote:
...Adder REALLY cares about the shirt world. His blog is very well done and he says things out of care...

Again, loquaciousness abounds.

Phew, long post alright, though mine wasn't much shorter. But what's this about Adder having a blog? I read more than I post, and this is the first I've heard about such a thing.