walmazan


quality posts: 65 Private Messages walmazan

Congrats on the sale out!

Well deserved!

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
Smoothesuede wrote:With every post you make, I like you more and more. :O
Just thought I'd tell you that.



Hey I can't really tell if you're being sarcastic or not lol, but I will say thank you anyway, just in case =) I'll take anything over pointless fallacies from annoying bone-headed trolls!

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docsbear


quality posts: 3 Private Messages docsbear
akd85 wrote:Where does he get the votes?

I mean, I am not even mad... I just want to know where the votes are coming from

Am I missing something?

I am super surprised the awesome Mario shirt didn't win. That was the best shirt I have seen ever in a derby. Good art. Good concept. Good parody.



Well, I liked it, so I voted for it. That's one... anyone else?

jmmbell1987


quality posts: 78 Private Messages jmmbell1987
Smoothesuede wrote:snip for length



A number of people (myself included) would also disagree that his designs are good. Not that he lacks the talent to make good designs, but that what he does design for woot isn't good.

However, you're pretty spot on about the issue of topics being the biggest issue. I'd add originality to that as well. Those have always been my biggest gripes with ramyb and sekiyoku. Designs I dislike by other artists routinely win derbies, but it's Ramyb and Sekiyoku who time and time again pay lip service to the theme and/or come up with designs containing no originality in concept or execution. They're like movie studios from this decade: whatever sells, based on formula, they'll do. Many are fine with that. I, for one, wish there was more quality control and enforcement of the rules, so that derbies could realize their full potential for a diverse range of artists, and not be Ramy/Seki's place to sell their designs to the masses.

arcturusk1


quality posts: 0 Private Messages arcturusk1
RaveDroid wrote:It would be easier to take you seriously if you could conduct yourself with more civility, lol.



It would be easier to take you seriously if you stopped using lol at the end of your sentences, lol. ucwutididthar, lol?

yayro wrote:As for education, start here.



Well said! Someone wanted information and they got it. That link is very interesting.

RaveDroid wrote:Welfare comes from the (obsolete) Old English "wellfare" - it's the same word, just maybe not as "P.C." as the modern derivation. I'm no hypocrite, I wouldn't say anything about other people's poor English if I couldn't even master my own lol



I'm rolling my eyes as hard as I can. This has to be the most elaborate and ridiculous excuse for misspelling a word I have ever seen. It has nothing to do with being PC and yes, your English is poor. See the following:

From One online dictionary:
[Middle English, from wel faren, to fare well, from Old English wel faran : wel, well; see well2 + faran, to get along; see fare.]

From Another online dictionary down at the bottom of the page:
O.E. wel faran "condition of being or doing well," from wel (see well (adv.)) + faran "get along" (see fare (v.)).

Do a little more in-depth researching next time before posting an incorrect and stupid excuse, ok? Tool.

F**k it, we'll do it live.

TheSadPanda


quality posts: 0 Private Messages TheSadPanda
Gatzby wrote:It will be available here tomorrow for $15.



Thanks for the help

xazothia


quality posts: 54 Private Messages xazothia
thinkingbox wrote:what is it about the shirts that really bother you? Is it the sameness? Do you feel the guy just can't draw?



I used to say so on his derby entries, but stopped since he'd keep repeating "I'll take that into consideration in the future!" and then proceeded not to, but yes, my main problem with Ramy is that he is not drawing to a level he is capable of. I said many moons ago (I believe it was the circus derby) that the style of his artwork wasn't my problem, it was the bad anatomy. Even for a cartoon, even allowing for the amount of stylization I feel that all artists are entitled to employ, I get the distinct impression that Ramy is all style over substance ("shine" over solid lineart), and that all he really needs to do is spend an extra five minutes to google something to see what it really looks like before he puts pen to paper, stylus to tablet, whatever.

But he doesn't bother to do that. It's lazy. Not spending two seconds of your time to type the name of an animal into google image search is absolutely freaking lazy. Seki is guilty of the same thing, and in her case it's even worse, since she seems to have less of the underlying drawing skill than Ramy does. To me, this is not an insurmountable obstacle. It's just one they have refused month after month to give a damn about, and that's where my personal problem with these two comes in.

My other problem is that woot's sales records have shown that these two could be running a very lucrative business as individuals if they opened their own freakin' shirt shop. Startup costs? Woot has paid them more than enough to cover those. Their individual profit margins would actually be higher without woot as the middle-man. From a business perspective, I don't understand why they don't just start their own design company, make their own shirts, make more of their own money, and leave the other designers at woot room to get themselves started instead.

docsbear


quality posts: 3 Private Messages docsbear

[quote postid="3735757" user="thinkingbox]
I understand your frustration in seeing the same thing over and over, but at its core, woot is a business. They're a friendly, amiable business that we all enjoy throwing money at, they're funny and clever and easy to like, but they're still a business, and at the end of the day they provide for their families and maintain their lifestyles based on doing what will be best for the bottom line. Which seems to be a Ramy shirt every now and then.[/quote]

Well said!!! Thank you.

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
arcturusk1 wrote:I'm rolling my eyes as hard as I can. This has to be the most elaborate and ridiculous excuse for misspelling a word I have ever seen. It has nothing to do with being PC and yes, your English is poor. See the following:

[snipped for others who are disinterested]

Do a little more in-depth researching next time before posting an incorrect and stupid excuse, ok? Tool.



Oh, you're one of those annoying bone-headed trolls I was referring to earlier. Pleased to meet you.
/sarcasm

Why yes I was in fact the president of my university's English honour society, thanks for asking.

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miren78


quality posts: 1 Private Messages miren78
RaveDroid wrote:Welfare comes from the (obsolete) Old English "wellfare" - it's the same word, just maybe not as "P.C." as the modern derivation. I'm no hypocrite, I wouldn't say anything about other people's poor English if I couldn't even master my own lol



Please forgive my assumption that you were referring to the modern welfare system rather than the Old English one.

Just wanted to make the point that no one is perfect. I hate bad grammar as much as the next English major, but I don't think it should be a sole point of attack. Just because someone's method of communication isn't as honed as yours doesn't mean he/she doesn't have a valid point to convey.

As stated before, in a variety of ways by a variety of people, people tend to be more defensive when they feel someone is attacking them directly rather than responding to their argument(s). (This, of course, applies to both sides.)

So anyway, can't we all just get along? (And yes, I am aware of the irony of asking that question on an internet forum.)

End wall of text.

thinkingbox


quality posts: 0 Private Messages thinkingbox
xazothia wrote:My other problem is that woot's sales records have shown that these two could be running a very lucrative business as individuals if they opened their own freakin' shirt shop. Startup costs? Woot has paid them more than enough to cover those. Their individual profit margins would actually be higher without woot as the middle-man. From a business perspective, I don't understand why they don't just start their own design company, make their own shirts, make more of their own money, and leave the other designers at woot room to get themselves started instead.



I've seen a couple other people mention that, and it seems like a pretty good idea from a monetary standpoint. However, I have to wonder if they don't stay here because the exposure they get from woot is huge; much bigger than they could expect from starting up another t-shirt site on the internet. They already have an established storefront here. All their overhead, hosting costs, advertising, printing and shipping are taken care of. They already have an established fanbase that may not follow them to a new site. All stuff that, were they to open their own business they would have to do themselves, from the ground up and would cost them extra money. You could hire an outside company to do all that for you, granted, but I wonder if they just don't want to start, essentially, from scratch with a whole truckload of new hassles on top of just designing shirts.

That's just the way I see it. Perhaps their business philosophy mirrors their design philosophy of "just do what works."

miren78


quality posts: 1 Private Messages miren78
arcturusk1 wrote:RaveDroid wrote:
It would be easier to take you seriously if you could conduct yourself with more civility, lol.

It would be easier to take you seriously if you stopped using lol at the end of your sentences, lol. ucwutididthar, lol?



desu!

Although I do believe it is an attempt to appear inoffensive. Forgive me if I am incorrect in this assumption.

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
miren78 wrote:Please forgive my assumption that you were referring to the modern welfare system rather than the Old English one.

Just wanted to make the point that no one is perfect. I hate bad grammar as much as the next English major, but I don't think it should be a sole point of attack. Just because someone's method of communication isn't as honed as yours doesn't mean he/she doesn't have a valid point to convey.

As stated before, in a variety of ways by a variety of people, people tend to be more defensive when they feel someone is attacking them directly rather than responding to their argument(s). (This, of course, applies to both sides.)

So anyway, can't we all just get along? (And yes, I am aware of the irony of asking that question on an internet forum.)

End wall of text.




Honestly I actually was referring to the modern American welfare system, but I did mention that my spelling of "wellfare" is more or less OBSOLETE (as some apparently failed to notice) even though it carries the same meaning - but I also prefer using "colour" and other older/foreign word spellings occasionally and I certainly wouldn't expect to have my proper use of English criticized simply because I have a more thorough understanding of it than some people (I am really into word etymologies), especially if the point is missed entirely.

And you are right about people that actually DO have valid points - if someone is clearly attempting to be agreeable and not attacking other persons then it's not like I'd jump all over them about an English slip-up. It's just worse when I see careless English and a bad attitude on the forums.

I've really tried hard to avoid personal attacks in any of my posts - sometimes it is very tempting, but that wouldn't make me any better than those who mess around on here just for that reason. If I disagree with someone then sometimes I let them know, but if someone inspires legitimate discussion, I like to acknowledge that as well, to their credit.

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RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
miren78 wrote:desu!

Although I do believe it is an attempt to appear inoffensive. Forgive me if I am incorrect in this assumption.



You're right - I use it only to remind people that I'm still smiling

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theoneill555


quality posts: 56 Private Messages theoneill555

You could be a King or a Streetsweeper but sooner or later, you dance with the Reaper!

That's O'neill with two L's *holds up three fingers*

Smoothesuede


quality posts: 9 Private Messages Smoothesuede
miren78 wrote:desu!

Although I do believe it is an attempt to appear inoffensive. Forgive me if I am incorrect in this assumption.


One friend texts another friend: "You're an ass."

One friend texts another friend: "You're an ass, lol"

Difference noted. ;) I often use the good ol' "arbitrary lol" rule. Softens blows and makes people agree with you UNLESS it's overused. Then you look like a clown.

bassanimation


quality posts: 98 Private Messages bassanimation
Akashhhhh wrote:Can someone enlighten me, I've done a bunch of Google searches and I can't find any evidence that these oft-printed artists rig the vote.



My friend also did some serious web digging about this awhile back, just out of her own curiosity. She found nothing that suggests cheating here. Not even on the oft-mentioned Gaia.

Occam's Razor. People actually like and want to purchase the shirt(s).

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
Smoothesuede wrote:One friend texts another friend: "You're an ass."

One friend texts another friend: "You're an ass, lol"

Difference noted. ;) I often use the good ol' "arbitrary lol" rule. Softens blows and makes people agree with you UNLESS it's overused. Then you look like a clown.



Haha, I like that :D
So yea I mean, if your post is riddled with lol's I can see that as getting out of hand and very difficult to read. Occasional use typically can mean 'that comment was meant to be taken lightly.' Some people need to remember to lighten up!

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theoneill555


quality posts: 56 Private Messages theoneill555
MissJamieD wrote:And.. Where are his FEET?! Not even a little toe peeking from the bottom of the cape?

Clearly, I see (beneath the horse's face) the standard bars where one puts their feet. They are indeed unoccupied.

Conclusion: this is one short reaper that(assuming from historical depictions)goes through one MAJOR growth spurt! I propose that his hypothalamus is abnormal, or his anterior pituitary.



one word explanation - chibi

That's O'neill with two L's *holds up three fingers*

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
theoneill555 wrote:one word explanation - chibi



Isn't the grim reaper usually portrayed as being some kind of floating ghostly thing? Seems like I've seen one stylized that way before... No feet and all, so maybe that's what he's going with.

But, I can totally see what you're saying about the possibility of chibi lol. I mean, it's ramy after all. XD

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AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
RaveDroid wrote:It would be easier to take you seriously if you could conduct yourself with more civility, lol. The only reason I'm even keeping up the discussion is because I happen to like a few people on this forum, and I'd like for them to trust that I'm not intending to look for trouble. =]



The idea of someone who supports a party that is notoriously against basic human rights for minorities, women, people I love, etc to expect people to be civil to them is pathetic. If none of your policies exist based on basic humanity, I am going to presume you are not a basic human, and disdain you as such. It is more than you deserve.

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
AdderXYU wrote:The idea of someone who supports a party that is notoriously against basic human rights for minorities, women, people I love, etc to expect people to be civil to them is pathetic. If none of your policies exist based on basic humanity, I am going to presume you are not a basic human, and disdain you as such. It is more than you deserve.



With the attitude you convey it kind of sounds like it's "more than you deserve" for me to even bother saying anything, but I did just want to say again (in case you didn't read before posting) that I don't support any party, and I didn't say I did. Because I DON'T.

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thinkingbox


quality posts: 0 Private Messages thinkingbox
xazothia wrote:I understand your perspective and it makes sense, but given that woot is not the only website on which they have a large following (DeviantArt, Gaia Online, even physical presence at conventions) I don't think "exposure" is really the issue they'd have with going outside of woot.



Ah, okay. Didn't know any of that. So maybe it's just everything on the procedural side of things? Manufacturing, shipping, billing etc. Also, it takes a specific mindset to run your own business successfully. For example: A friend of mine teaches martial arts. All he wants to do is teach and train, he doesn't want to do accounting, billing, advertising and everything else that comes with running a business. He does it, because he has to, but I'm sure if he had somebody willing to do all the drudgework for him he'd be perfectly happy to just kick people around because that's the part he likes.

miren78


quality posts: 1 Private Messages miren78
Smoothesuede wrote:One friend texts another friend: "You're an ass."

One friend texts another friend: "You're an ass, lol"

Difference noted. ;) I often use the good ol' "arbitrary lol" rule. Softens blows and makes people agree with you UNLESS it's overused. Then you look like a clown.



Agreed.

Unfortunately, it's very difficult to properly convey your attitude through typing (sarcasm being a prime example). So when people are trying to show they aren't intending to be vicious or snide, they often resort to some other method to show that. Unfortunately it's often easy to misunderstand or misuse those methods. (It's sort of like the grammar issue, except with way less established structure.)

As others have pointed out before me, there needs to be a sarcasm font...and probably an "I'm really not trying to be mean here" font too. In the meantime, emoticons, "lol," and "\sarcasm" are the best we have.

Of course none of this prevents trolling, but it might help those of us who attempt to carry on civilized conversations.

drasham


quality posts: 0 Private Messages drasham

wow, sold out before I even saw it!

thinkingbox


quality posts: 0 Private Messages thinkingbox
miren78 wrote:Agreed.

Unfortunately, it's very difficult to properly convey your attitude through typing (sarcasm being a prime example). So when people are trying to show they aren't intending to be vicious or snide, they often resort to some other method to show that. Unfortunately it's often easy to misunderstand or misuse those methods. (It's sort of like the grammar issue, except with way less established structure.)

As others have pointed out before me, there needs to be a sarcasm font...and probably an "I'm really not trying to be mean here" font too. In the meantime, emoticons, "lol," and "\sarcasm" are the best we have.



A lot of depends on the reader, too. I often wonder how we ever got along in all those years before the internet and text messaging made "lol" and "j/k ;)" our Get Out of Jail Free card for text communication. People have been using sarcasm for centuries and had to convey it without immediately recanting to "(j/k)" after every ironic quip. I just do without, and if somebody takes an obvious joke at face value, well, I'll probably never have to deal with you in person anyway, so good luck! Surprisingly, or not surprisingly depending on your level of cynicism, people will eventually catch on, they just need to re-engage the analytical-thinking-as-it-relates-to-reading muscles in their brains.

So hey, everybody wins!

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
thinkingbox wrote:(Disclaimer: This is not a confrontational post. This is not a personal attack. I am asking a legitimate question. Why am I hearing this disclaimer in a robot voice in my head? Also, I got carried away and strayed way into tl;dr territory, so I applaud and thank anyone that actually reads the whole thing.)

It seems like those who decry woot for continually printing Ramy and Seki shirts, beyond the perpetual vote-rigging accusations (please do not provide links to prove your point; that is not the crux of my argument) all claim that the designs are lacking in artistic merit and rehash the same designs over and over again. Without agreeing or disagreeing with either of those accusations, I have to ask a question:

How do you feel about these guys?

Now, I admit, I'm not a fan. I worked with them for years in a technical capacity and they most certainly do not "just work." They're fine machines, but they cost more than an equivalent device under most circumstances, they are proprietary and occassionally incompatible. However! I will readily admit, with great fervor and enthusiasm, that they have marketing down to an exact science. Their marketing machine works like gangbusters, and I've been wanting to use that word for a while. If there was a Nobel Prize for Marketing, they would win -- retroactively and pre-emptively -- forever. They have a very sound design philosophy, they know what will sell products and they never deviate from what works.

And so it seems to me that woot prints these shirts because, primarily, people want them. I mean the shirt just sold out, which means at least a couple thousand people, give or take, wanted one? Secondly, woot's model seems to be, "You there, on the internet! Vote for the shirt you would most like to wear. On your body. In public, if that's your thing." That's a pretty straightforward model, and if most of the people out there don't want clever, thoughtful new shirt designs every week then so be it, the masses have spoken. I like the shirt because the juxtaposition amuses me, but I wouldn't wear it, which means that several thousand people disagree with me, and that's fine.

So I invite anyone that wants to respond, especially Adder because he seems like a pretty sharp guy and I'd be interested in hearing his opinion, what is it about the shirts that really bother you? Is it the sameness? Do you feel the guy just can't draw?

I understand your frustration in seeing the same thing over and over, but at its core, woot is a business. They're a friendly, amiable business that we all enjoy throwing money at, they're funny and clever and easy to like, but they're still a business, and at the end of the day they provide for their families and maintain their lifestyles based on doing what will be best for the bottom line. Which seems to be a Ramy shirt every now and then.



To start with, I will never buy Apple. They are all about marketing and not remotely about product. When I hear people say "On my third iPod!" or "My iPhone broke again! And the warranty's almost up!" I say to myself "why is this gumball still buying apple products?" I've never used an apple computer that made me feel it was worth the nearly twice as much that a PC costs. And simply put, I consider iTunes to be the biggest insult to real, quality music since Milli Vanilli won a Grammy.

Fast forwarding to what I have a problem with with Ramy and Seki: As I've said before, if someone came to my office with a resume of being fired from a number of other places for cheating the company, I would curbstomp them before I allowed them NEAR my company. To me, it doesn't matter what woot thinks they have or haven't done. I don't for a second believe woot can or will put in the effort to analyze it. The fact is, the blatant fact, is that they spend every week making insulting designs. Designs with no topicality, no originality, and often no execution. They show no respect to the site or their fellow designers by doing that. But they should never have been allowed here in the first place. They have been proven to have cheated and manipulated rules a number of times elsewhere, and that should be enough to keep them from ever printing here. That's basic morals and ethics. By allowing them to print, and saying it's OK because it's business, you're saying you have no morals or ethics.

When your only argument is "it sells, so it's OK, because this is business," it is clear you've never looked at businesses who are about more than just sales. A business has a responsibility to have a moral, ethical compass. It's not all about selling the most, nor is it all about being the most popular. Well, for some companies it is. But what does it say about you or anyone when you are able to find money to be reason enough to accept anything? "woot's just a business". Why is that OK? Why are we so indoctrinated in this "capitalism over all" mentality. Do you honestly think that that is what makes people happy or successful or defines worth? Why do you think McDonalds has such a bad rap despite being so profitable? Popularity does not define worth. Refusing to demand and expect better is refusing to value worth over sales. It shouldn't matter to you what woot is selling if you're not passionate about the quality and meaning behind their company. You are not making a cent off them. Insisting it's OK because it makes them money implies you want to be in their shoes, and sell whatever junk you can scrounge up just for a paycheck.

See, that IS wrong, no matter what our capitalocracy seems to think. If your only motivation is money, and if money is all the motivation someone else needs to be respected, then your value system is worthless. You have nothing worth fighting for, and want to make sure no one else has anything worth fighting for. It is disgusting that there are people in this world who do not see the bigger picture. It's not just a shirt. How the derby works out is meaningful to art as a whole. It's meaningful to business as a whole. As it stands, it pisses on real creative effort and work, and thumbs its nose at the idea that it's better to sell great work at smaller quantities than trash enough to blow your nose in cash. Every time a piece like this wins, it has a real, negative effect, no matter how small, on the real world of art and the real world of business. Ramy's work represents an ignorant, dumbed down America. Which is why the comparison in today's writeup works so well, no matter how woot intended it. Both results are due to a world that is too jaded to stand up and improve things, and as we become so jaded, it becomes worse.

So yes, I find Ramy's work repulsive "artistically". I find it generic and certainly overdone at this site. I find it offensively cavalier toward other artists here and woot's rules in general, regardless of woot allowing them to not be on topic ever (that allowance being a disgustingness of woot itself, as well). I think that his incredibly shady past should put him on warning to begin with, because it is truth, not fiction. It's not like you can create such wide-ranging, multi-site drama fests without a reason. But it is symptomatic of an even larger issue of majorities ruling where they have no right to. It's incredibly limiting, stagnating, stultifying. It harms the art world here, which branches into the art world elsewhere. It kills the desire to create and fosters a cynicism of WIN WIN WIN regardless of quality being given out, or a cynicism of giving up, knowing your work will always be ignored no matter how much passion, creativity, etc you put in. It is not something to be proud of, to support that limitation in defense of capitalism. Capitalism failed.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
thinkingbox wrote:I've seen a couple other people mention that, and it seems like a pretty good idea from a monetary standpoint. However, I have to wonder if they don't stay here because the exposure they get from woot is huge; much bigger than they could expect from starting up another t-shirt site on the internet. They already have an established storefront here. All their overhead, hosting costs, advertising, printing and shipping are taken care of. They already have an established fanbase that may not follow them to a new site. All stuff that, were they to open their own business they would have to do themselves, from the ground up and would cost them extra money. You could hire an outside company to do all that for you, granted, but I wonder if they just don't want to start, essentially, from scratch with a whole truckload of new hassles on top of just designing shirts.

That's just the way I see it. Perhaps their business philosophy mirrors their design philosophy of "just do what works."



It is not their storefront.

But you're right, the sole reason ramy and seki don't open another store is because wooters are cheap, lazy, and will never seek them out. They will never bring in as much bank from their own shop as they would here, and they are ONLY about money. Not art. Not quality. Not diversity.

Again, being only about money is a sign of a moral and ethical void. I may be a coarse jerk around here, but I stand for something. Ramy and Seki stand for nothing but peddling unskilled, unoriginal work to people who don't care.

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
AdderXYU wrote:major snippage!



Adder, why do you feel the need to use the woot forums for your personal blog? lol I mean if I were as frustrated as you appear to be, I really by now would have just said screw it and decided to stay away.
So, I just want to know... If you do have such a problem with the way the site is run or the derbies, or artists, or whatever, why are you still here and why do you keep coming back?

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nyren


quality posts: 1 Private Messages nyren
RaveDroid wrote:Adder, why do you feel the need to use the woot forums for your personal blog? lol I mean if I were as frustrated as you appear to be, I really by now would have just said screw it and decided to stay away.
So, I just want to know... If you do have such a problem with the way the site is run or the derbies, or artists, or whatever, why are you still here and why do you keep coming back?



RaveDroid, why do you feel the need to use the woot forums for your own personal views about Adder? lol I mean if I were as frustrated as you appear to be I really by now would have just said screw it and decided not to post. So, I just want to know... If you do have such a problem with the way that Adder posts or whatever, why did you feel the need to post this instead of just walking away? You're clearly not here to buy shirts.

miren78


quality posts: 1 Private Messages miren78
xazothia wrote:I understand your perspective and it makes sense, but given that woot is not the only website on which they have a large following (DeviantArt, Gaia Online, even physical presence at conventions) I don't think "exposure" is really the issue they'd have with going outside of woot. You're right that it mirrors their design philosophy: "Be lazy".



I really appreciate your responses. They're definitely easier to digest than a lot of the other comments regarding ramy & seki. While I believe that many of those comments are valid, it's easy to see where someone who's new to the situation might read them as "I have a personal vendetta against shiny/cute/chibi stuff and I will attack anyone who disagrees with me!"

All that does is make newcomers sorry for ramy & seki. As for the folks following this mess, most of us have already picked a side and there isn't much point in berating each other over it. I don't believe insulting someone is going to make them suddenly say "Oi! I've been so blind, how could I possibly have thought that? Thanks for calling me an utter M0R0N and helping me see the light!!!"

That said, I don't think people should stop commenting on the situation, because there are a lot of people that haven't been following along. Just try to be civil about it. There's proof that it can be done!

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
RaveDroid wrote:Adder, why do you feel the need to use the woot forums for your personal blog? lol I mean if I were as frustrated as you appear to be, I really by now would have just said screw it and decided to stay away.
So, I just want to know... If you do have such a problem with the way the site is run or the derbies, or artists, or whatever, why are you still here and why do you keep coming back?



Those who see potential and do not fight for it are no better than those who squash potential and do not feel remorse.

fishcake56


quality posts: 0 Private Messages fishcake56

maaaaan, this t-shirt thread is a big bag o' fun all in itself

miren78


quality posts: 1 Private Messages miren78
thinkingbox wrote:A lot of depends on the reader, too. I often wonder how we ever got along in all those years before the internet and text messaging made "lol" and "j/k ;)" our Get Out of Jail Free card for text communication. People have been using sarcasm for centuries and had to convey it without immediately recanting to "(j/k)" after every ironic quip. I just do without, and if somebody takes an obvious joke at face value, well, I'll probably never have to deal with you in person anyway, so good luck! Surprisingly, or not surprisingly depending on your level of cynicism, people will eventually catch on, they just need to re-engage the analytical-thinking-as-it-relates-to-reading muscles in their brains.

So hey, everybody wins!



I agree that most analytical-thinking people will (sooner or later depending on the person) come to the correct conclusion. However, I have met some very intelligent people that have problems with taking things that they read, well, literally. Of course, sarcasm is completely lost on some of them even in person, but I digress.

Some folks (whose opinions are still worthwhile) just need a helping hand with interpretation. Guess you just have to consider your audience (which varies greatly in the wide wonderful world of the interwebs) and not take offense easily.

The44thHour


quality posts: 0 Private Messages The44thHour

One day he could grow up to be the next shirt.woot reckoner. Be nice.

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
AdderXYU wrote:Those who see potential and do not fight for it are no better than those who squash potential and do not feel remorse.



Ok, so you really aren't completely disgusted with shirt.woot. Not that I see that a t-shirt website is worth fighting for lol, but I acknowledge and respect your point on this.

If you can read this, yourᅠbrowser'sᅠCompatibilityᅠsettings
areᅠconfiguredᅠcorrectly.ᅠᅠツ

RaveDroid


quality posts: 15 Private Messages RaveDroid
nyren wrote:RaveDroid, why do you feel the need to use the woot forums for your own personal views about Adder? lol I mean if I were as frustrated as you appear to be I really by now would have just said screw it and decided not to post. So, I just want to know... If you do have such a problem with the way that Adder posts or whatever, why did you feel the need to post this instead of just walking away? You're clearly not here to buy shirts.



I would like to be given the courtesy of asking an honest question without being harrassed for once, thank you.

Also I own about 10 woot shirts, FYI. It doesn't show because they were bought on my previous account (email changed), and I haven't purchased any since then.

If you can read this, yourᅠbrowser'sᅠCompatibilityᅠsettings
areᅠconfiguredᅠcorrectly.ᅠᅠツ

kimvy


quality posts: 0 Private Messages kimvy
yayro wrote:Unfortunately, that's not quite the case. The derby winner gets $1000 regardless of how many shirts sell. Even if no one buys the shirts, if the votes are there in the derby, the payout is there as well.

As for education, start here.



Interesting and thanks for the link. It's a shame that woot wants to allow people with a possibly shady and dubious history to participate.

Also, thanks for the info about the winner's prize.

If woot doesn't care, which seems to be the case, then it's up to each person to decide on their moral bearings and what they interpret the situation to be and go from there.

With your link and what I read on past postings (did a search on the artist's name and vote rigging), then the "democracy leaps into the vacuum" message is way uncool.

I'm fairly new here, but was looking forward to buying lots of shirts. Now I have to re-think this. A shame.

miren78


quality posts: 1 Private Messages miren78
RaveDroid wrote:I would like to be given the courtesy of asking an honest question without being harrassed for once, thank you.

Also I own about 10 woot shirts, FYI. It doesn't show because they were bought on my previous account (email changed), and I haven't purchased any since then.



Good luck sir! Once certain people decide that they don't like something that you've said or done at some point in your existence here, you're a target. At least until they find someone else they like less.

Welcome to the internet, land of grudges. Be sure to wear a thick skin, and remember that struggling in quicksand only drives you deeper.

boxplayer


quality posts: 2 Private Messages boxplayer

I think the "flames from Hades" idea is right. Just a few little hyper-geothermic portals to remind us that it's really Down There. And people like me who love this shirt and buy it will probably be taking one of those as the Down Elevator (hmmm ... Oxy the gumball strikes again) in some future time. Might be worth it.