Shirt.Woot

So, based on the number of Wooters that are disappointed that the QR code doesn't work ( myself included), someone should make a shirt design that does! ( I'm not one of the artsy-creative types, so don't look at me,)

Sorry the code doesn't work. The design was meant to parody those Elementary school Composition books. That's why the pattern is uniformly "marble like." Luckily, here's an alternate design that may be more to your liking.

5of0 wrote:Umm, sorry, but did you try scanning the image I put up there? My phone (with QR Droid) scans it without a hitch. It has to be a perfectly square grid of pixels, yes, but nothing says those pixels themselves have to be square. And in fact, there are mechanisms in the QR code precisely so that those pixels don't have to be square - because they almost never actually are. Almost no one takes a picture of a QR code exactly straight on, so the pixels will always be distorted and trapezoids - or, in this case, rectangles.

And I'm pretty confident that (except for QR version 1), the fourth square is a crucial part of the format, but I don't know that for sure.

Despite the shape of the pixels, there are still more of them in one dimension than in the other. It's possible your scanner is cutting out some of the middle by detecting it as an error/graphic (the "ruled lines" graphic perhaps). It still wouldn't be using the blackened outer area you added, since that's outside of the positional elements.

QR does only require 3 positional elements. Most QR codes only have 3 (I'm not including the smaller alignment element, which this shirt also doesn't have). You appear to have a more forgiving scanner than most posters here

equazcion wrote:Despite the shape of the pixels, there are still more of them in one dimension than in the other. It's possible your scanner is cutting out some of the middle by detecting it as an error/graphic (the "ruled lines" graphic perhaps). It still wouldn't be using the blackened outer area you added, since that's outside of the positional elements.

QR does only require 3 positional elements. Most QR codes only have 3 (I'm not including the smaller alignment element, which this shirt also doesn't have). You appear to have a more forgiving scanner than most posters here

I just counted them, and there are 29 pixels horizontally, 29 pixels vertically. And the blackened outer area is just the black of the shirt, not part of the code...I'm not sure why it would be part of the code. And the smaller alignment element is what I was referring to (my "fourth reference point") - I agree with you there, that no QR codes have four of the big ones. And have you tried scanning it with something other than the crap online scanners?

And of course it's ignoring the graphic - that's what the QR code is built to do - ignore errors. This QR code isn't as error-tolerant and requires a more head-on scan than most (because there's a lot of added error already), but it does actually scan.

All kinds of neat stuff can be done with QR codes

lucky1988 wrote:Sorry the code doesn't work. The design was meant to parody those Elementary school Composition books. That's why the pattern is uniformly "marble like." Luckily, there's an alternate design that may be more to your liking.

So no linear algebra puns were intended?

There seems to be some confusion as to what parts of the graphic are and aren't part of the code, so here's a diagram to clear it up:



There's enough format information and error correction data for QR decoders to figure that out.

5of0 wrote:I just counted them, and there are 29 pixels horizontally, 29 pixels vertically. And the blackened outer area is just the black of the shirt, not part of the code...I'm not sure why it would be part of the code. And the smaller alignment element is what I was referring to (my "fourth reference point") - I agree with you there, that no QR codes have four of the big ones. And have you tried scanning it with something other than the crap online scanners?

And of course it's ignoring the graphic - that's what the QR code is built to do - ignore errors. This QR code isn't as error-tolerant and requires a more head-on scan than most (because there's a lot of added error already), but it does actually scan.

I count 41 vertical pixels, including the graphic.

The center "graphic" is actually made up of a series of black or white squares, the same size as the other pixels. There's no real reason a scanner would ignore them as errors, unless your scanner ignores less random-looking pixel placement (eg. pixels that make up solid, evenly-spaced lines), which is what it appears to be doing. Again it seems your scanner works differently from most others -- it might be "smarter", or perhaps buggier, depending on your perspective.

. mispost

equazcion wrote:I count 41 vertical pixels, including the graphic.

The center "graphic" is actually made up of a series of black or white squares, the same size as the other pixels. There's no real reason a scanner would ignore them as errors, unless your scanner ignores less random-looking pixel placement (eg. pixels that make up solid, evenly-spaced lines), which is what it appears to be doing. Again it seems your scanner works differently from most others -- it might be "smarter", or perhaps buggier, depending on your perspective.

But see, the QR format is neat and contains alignment pixels - there is a horizontal and a vertical row of "calibration" pixels that tell it what size the pixels are. From Wikipedia:



The label doesn't obscure that key column, so the scanners can figure out what the pixel size is, and correctly determine the QR code. I updated my image above to point those out.

Are there other Wooters who have tried and succeeded (or failed) in scanning my design? Because I can try tweaking it if no one else can scan it.

5of0 wrote:I beg to differ:

Stick that in your QR scanner and decode it. A true geek would know that QR codes are built to be very error-resistant, so they can be pretty distorted/obscured and work just fine.

Now, I looked at it and noticed the lack of the fourth reference point in the lower-right and was sad - that, unlike non-squareness, is a dead giveaway - but tried scanning it anyway out of desperation and disappointment, because really, why would someone do this and *not* make it a real QR code? Sigh.

If you're going to flame the designer at least make an effort to stay true to the original design. Try recreating the image without distorting everything. I think you'll find it's not that easy regardless what level of error correction you're using.

5of0 wrote:But see, the QR format is neat and contains alignment pixels - there is a horizontal and a vertical row of "calibration" pixels that tell it what size the pixels are. From Wikipedia:

The label doesn't obscure that key column, so the scanners can figure out what the pixel size is, and correctly determine the QR code.

Again, the "label" is just a series of pixels, merely more orderly-placed. There's no reason it would obscure anything -- its pixels would be read as part of the code; again, unless your scanner ignores pixels that look to be suspiciously too orderly.

kyrmada wrote:If you're going to flame the designer at least make an effort to stay true to the original design. Try recreating the image without distorting everything. I think you'll find it's not that easy regardless what level of error correction you're using.

Sorry, I wasn't trying to flame the designer in the least, and apologize if I came across as doing so. lucky1988 is an excellent designer, and it's a cute design. If anything I was flaming equazcion for challenging my geekdom and being wrong :P

Erring on the side of looking not distorted is a choice - a design choice. I'm not saying it was the wrong choice - it does look nicer, and looks more like one of those notebooks than my design does. But I was erring on the side of making a working QR code, which requires distorting the design. I, personally, would take a more distorted-looking shirt over one that didn't actually scan, so I created such a thing to prove that it could be done. It seems at least a few Wooters agree.

equazcion wrote:Again, the "label" is just a series of pixels, merely more orderly-placed. There's no reason it would obscure anything -- its pixels would be read as part of the code; again, unless your scanner ignores pixels that look to be suspiciously too orderly.

But its a series of wrongly-sized pixels - as determined by the calibration row/column - so the scanner ignores them, or guesses wrong at them, and the error correction takes care of that. With the level of error correction I used, 30% of the data can just not be there or be totally wrong, and it would still work. There's a lot of math going on behind the scenes that make it so that you can do stuff exactly like this with QR codes.

5of0 wrote:Are there other Wooters who have tried and succeeded (or failed) in scanning my design? Because I can try tweaking it if no one else can scan it.

Your design works fine for my phone. And I think the point of the "composition" book come across fine. And I don't think your post was being insulting to the designer - just illustrating a concept. Not sure where all the hate is coming from.

5of0 wrote:But its a series of wrongly-sized pixels - as determined by the calibration row/column - so the scanner ignores them, or guesses wrong at them, and the error correction takes care of that. With the level of error correction I used, 30% of the data can just not be there or be totally wrong, and it would still work. There's a lot of math going on behind the scenes that make it so that you can do stuff exactly like this with QR codes.

You're right, I didn't realize you were referring to your design rather than the shirt, and that you had resized the label's pixels.

Though, my argument in my post which you originally responded to, was that the code in the shirt is plainly invalid due to its having more vertical pixels than horizontal. You haven't disproved that argument; though your altered design does correct the problem

Yet another wooter not buying becuase it doesn't go anywhere. If people are gonna come up and scan my boobs I want it to take them some place good - cause I'm not taking them there!

OnyxEyez wrote:Yet another wooter not buying becuase it doesn't go anywhere. If people are gonna come up and scan my boobs I want it to take them some place good - cause I'm not taking them there!

I do love the idea tho, and I love those composition books - I almost pulled the trigger based on the image alone.

OnyxEyez wrote:Yet another wooter not buying becuase it doesn't go anywhere. If people are gonna come up and scan my boobs I want it to take them some place good - cause I'm not taking them there!

So, you have boobs eh?

How ya doin?

I want composition books made like this!! Forget shirts :p

5of0 wrote:Sorry, I wasn't trying to flame the designer in the least, and apologize if I came across as doing so. lucky1988 is an excellent designer, and it's a cute design. If anything I was flaming equazcion for challenging my geekdom and being wrong :P

Erring on the side of looking not distorted is a choice - a design choice. I'm not saying it was the wrong choice - it does look nicer, and looks more like one of those notebooks than my design does. But I was erring on the side of making a working QR code, which requires distorting the design. I, personally, would take a more distorted-looking shirt over one that didn't actually scan, so I created such a thing to prove that it could be done. It seems at least a few Wooters agree.

No big deal, I think I was projecting since I actually complained at first about the code not scanning then regretted it later. A person puts time and energy into creating something and hangs it out on the line in the public eye then everyone starts griping about it... just seemed rude.

So I publicly apologize, I'm sorry lucky1988. I applaud your creativity and congratulate you for having one of, if not THE first QR code related T-shirts on shirt.woot!

5of0 wrote:See, as noted above, this would have been very possible, and I definitely would have bought the shirt had this been the case. But no...it's just a disappointment. Ah well.

I had seen this tattoo done with a similar idea, so I think we really could have gotten an epic piece if Lucky could have created a video to go with it, or could have collab'd with another artist, had he not been able to do it on his own.

I haven't seen clothing utilizing it in this way (at least, to my knowledge). I've contemplated something like this... I wouldn't have been able to get the video the way I wanted.

equazcion wrote:You're right, I didn't realize you were referring to your design rather than the shirt, and that you had resized the label's pixels.

Though, my argument in my post which you originally responded to, was that the code in the shirt is plainly invalid due to its having more vertical pixels than horizontal. You haven't disproved that argument; though your altered design does correct the problem

Oh yes, the shirt is invalid because it is rectangular pixel-wise - that there is true, and you were correct in that. Otherwise it could conceivably be a V1 code, even without the fourth alignment box. Good call, I hadn't thought about that.

handshake Hopefully things are cleared up now. Seems there was a good bit of miscommunication going on, sorry about that.

I've also updated the image in my original post, I realized after making the diagrams that my original image very nearly covered up the alignment column, making it hard to scan. I've corrected that, and it seems to scan better now. New image here.

Also, would you mind going back and taking the image out of the quote boxes? I don't think we need four copies of the image on page one, and the last three are the old, less-scannable ones anyway :P

equazcion wrote:So, you have boobs eh?

How ya doin?

Hey my eyes are up here!

Oh what, you were looking at the code? Suuuuure.

5of0 wrote:

Are there other Wooters who have tried and succeeded (or failed) in scanning my design? Because I can try tweaking it if no one else can scan it.

Worked instantly for me, shrug.

http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2437776&cid=37462656

"Even better: sell t-shirts that appear blank but display hipster slogans when viewed through an AR app."

in jest obviously, but cool concept.


nice shirt btw, just realized its marble.

paulec252 wrote:

5of0 wrote:I beg to differ:

I scanned that with the ZXing app on my tablet and at first it wouldn't scan. Then I rotated my tablet 90 degrees, and that did the trick! I don't know why, I guess it's a bug with the zxing algorithm.

That was an epic win

doronbc wrote:http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=2437776&cid=37462656

"Even better: sell t-shirts that appear blank but display hipster slogans when viewed through an AR app."

in jest obviously, but cool concept.


nice shirt btw, just realized its marble.

hyuk that would be awesome :P Also, you need to take out the "=" from your URL tag (as above), it's not working currently.

theimmc wrote:I scanned that with the ZXing app on my tablet and at first it wouldn't scan. Then I rotated my tablet 90 degrees, and that did the trick! I don't know why, I guess it's a bug with the zxing algorithm.

That was an epic win

I scanned this with QRReader on my iPhone 4 and it took me to shirt.woot.com.... hmmmm

rileyper wrote:

AAARRRRGH!

katanamaster wrote:I scanned this with QRReader on my iPhone 4 and it took me to shirt.woot.com.... hmmmm

That's all it's supposed to do...couldn't really come up with anything too much more exciting.

I just realized custom QR shirts would be a great application for Bleach T-shirts - which, in turn, might be a great reason to pick up the Woot today ;)

I dig the concept.

You just need to perfect your look of scorn when people scan you expecting to get a secret message... the secret is that it's a notebook, slowpoke! :^)

I don't have a smartphone =( I wish I could not see what y'all are not seeing.

hippie19 wrote:Jumping on the boat of disappointed people, if you make something look like a QR code, please please please make it scan to something.

I couldn't agree more. This is one of the most mind-boggling dropping-of-the-ball executions of creative juices I've ever seen in my life. I mean, I can't even wrap my head around someone that makes a shirt.woot that LOOKS like a QR code, but then it's NOT a QR code. At a very, very, very, Haitian minimum, this should have been a textual code that came back to "pwn't", "lol", or maybe a link to meatspin.

Unfortunately, as it is, we are left in the corner, in a fetal position, rocking back and forth asking ourselves: "OK, it's a QR code in the shape of a composition notebook that's not a QR code in the shape of a composition notebook. Instead of being surreal, it's actually kind of stupid."

This shirt design gets my vote for shirtus interruptus, and I find myself an extremely unsatisfied partner in this relationship. I may boycott woot for one week for even agreeing to sell this shirt.

I spit, vehemently, and without consideration for decorum, in the direction of the shirt woot people, and the designer.

I await your redemption, brothers.

Man... People take their QR codes seriously around here.

I, for one, congratulate Lucky on a creative design.

If you don't like the shirt, don't buy it, but you don't have to complain. Maybe it was designed with a different audience in mind-- not everything has to be made for you, you know.

theimmc wrote:I scanned that with the ZXing app on my tablet and at first it wouldn't scan. Then I rotated my tablet 90 degrees, and that did the trick! I don't know why, I guess it's a bug with the zxing algorithm.

That was an epic win

I had kinda the same issue. It wouldnt scan no matter what he said. Then you posted.

I rotated 90 degrees. Nothing. Then I went 180. Boom! Weird.

Now that all the QR nerdgasms are behind us....

I've always suspected those composition notebooks contained secret messages from the Illuminati. Nothing is random....< /tinfoilhat>