bluetuba wrote:Yeah, you did a *really* good job of copying it. The image above is something I've seen happen plenty of times with other artists who trace photos and it's pretty damning evidence. People are getting on your case because ALOT of your entries look like photos. You arguing about the line between stealing and not stealing rubs alot of people the wrong way. You are an artist right? You can draw something without making it look identical to your reference, and no I don't just mean making his arm a little longer or removing the clipboard he was holding.
Actually, the fit between the two isn't all that great. I used the brush tool when trying to draw it, and I wasn't all that concerned about details, beyond the shape.
I didn't know the hand would be blurred out, but I had drawn a towel for him in his left hand (more like a blob) and had it placed lower (like it was coming out of his pocket).
I also wanted him to look like he was stretching out more, to reach, so I drew the other limbs differently, as well.
On top of that, I didn't use any of the internal detail, just an outline (because I wasn't trying to make an exact copy, just a man reaching up with a squeegee). I was truly asking a philosophical question (looking for a 'rule of thumb') as to what is considered "original" - because that is a term that gets bandied about here, and seems to mean different things to different people. I'm not trying to "argue about the line between stealing and not stealing" - I am truly trying to understand how we define "original" so that I don't "rub people the wrong way". I am probably being naive, I realize, because I let people use my photos, music, and designs for whatever they want to use them for (like the designs I gave to theonering.net - a great place to link for LotR/Hobbit info, BtW - for SD Comic Con and for DragonCon). This is far, far more about the fun of designing and the challenge of a short timeline than it is about money. But it's not fun to upset folks, or be seen as a "rulebreaker" - which is why I've been asking questions.
As for using photos - I used some of my own photos as models (which should be fair game, since I took them) - particularly the shot of the Statue of Liberty. And in that case, I used it to get the different shaded areas, and then crosshatched them w/ brushes I had created. I fail to see how that is "stealing" or "cheating" or putting photos in the design. A couple of my other designs were rejected because my hatches were vector brushes, not hand-drawn (I guess), that I used as fills.
As for being an "artist", I haven't had an art class since 7th grade (30 years ago), but I've been a musician forever. By trade I am an engineer, and I've had to take on graphic design roles in my work and for some philanthropic organizations I belong to. My wife has a degree in design, so I have personal copies of Illustrator and Photoshop, which I've self-taught for the past couple of years. So I do have to either see something to draw it, electronically (though I can physically draw, so I just need to get a tablet and figure out how to use it).
As an engineer, though, I have had to learn all sorts of things about math, programming and efficiency, so I've been able to build some filters, brushes and symbols to speed up the process, and improve my designs.
The next thing I want to do is learn more how to draw cartoons, but I'm leaving for Tanzania this week for a couple of weeks (to help teach microfinance and English as part of a philanthropic trip sponsored by my employer), so I've been holding off on learning that until later this year.
A few weeks ago, I learned out how to make some more realistic fire effects and how to somewhat quickly (in 6-8 hours) convert them from raster to vector graphics, so that's been my focus recently.
bluetuba wrote:Is that clip-art? Alot of his work looks like spacy silhouettes of things and I'll betcha he draws them himself. Kharmazero has never been rejected for using clip art, but you have.
If you've detected photo tracing and clip art in other people's entries feel free to call them out on it and provide the evidence. They should all be rejected.
The kharmazero design has dozens of models from allshilhouettes.com, including this pack and this pack, along with African aminal and landmark packs of silhouettes.
It wasn't until I used the one you linked to that I even knew that the use of clipart could result in rejection.
As for calling others out for the use of clipart, that tends to fall into the realm of creating conflict, which isn't really why I do this. It would be nice, though, to have the same standards apply to everyone. Someone in the kharmazero thread pointed out the use of stock illustrations and the powers-that-be didn't seem to care, so why create more waves in that thread?