Derby #31: Water
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Swimming Koi

Swimming Koi
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klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Three Colorful Koi Swimming together.

The streaming of stars gives the movement of the fish and the water pattern. The addition of the light blue are the shadows on the fish when submerged in water. The fish are drawn with movement and fluidity to make them look like they are swimming in the water.

I tried to create the design much like I would paint on canvas, using broad brushstrokes to give the feeling of movement in the water. My hope was that the result would look like you were looking down upon the fish as they are swimming and the blue shadow on their body from the water as they swim freely.

jbedwar1


quality posts: 0 Private Messages jbedwar1
klswoot wrote:Three Colorful Koi Swimming together. The swirling stars are the swim patterns in the water.


wow... very interesting.

parkermc


quality posts: 23 Private Messages parkermc
Re: Swimming Koi


Perfect! Love the colors, design, and placement. GMV!

SailorButterfly


quality posts: 14 Private Messages SailorButterfly
Re: Swimming Koi


This is my favorite out of your entries. GMV ^^

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "Most Awesome Butterfly-Sailor Hybrid on Woot"

sailstud25


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sailstud25

Awesome colors, and loving the koi!

I posted this in Cho's wave thread, but you may be more likely to see it in your own shirt: can you pm me and explain how to put an image like your "vote ads" online to put into your sig since doesn't it require a url of the image? Also, I've noticed the tinyurl addresses before, but how do you do that too?

Thanks!

Hmm, just went in for 3 Randoms, when I haven't bought any shirts lately (although still checking frequently) so what are the chances of liking them!?! Oh well, couldn't pass up the mystery!
...a number of shirts on teetrade.com

H2O


quality posts: 0 Private Messages H2O
Re: Swimming Koi


Absolutely phoneminal (excuse me for spelling)

NotAGirl


quality posts: 0 Private Messages NotAGirl
Re: Swimming Koi


wow. these fish really get around huh?

http://www.designbyhumans.com/vote/detail/5165

Kerry672


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Kerry672

This is beautiful! Gmv!

chocolatechipcookie


quality posts: 0 Private Messages chocolatechipcookie
Kerry672 wrote:This is beautiful! Gmv!

quite a number of impressive entries from you...very nice.

Andy47240


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Andy47240
Re: Swimming Koi

I would love to know how you did the swirlys. Very awesome. Maybe you could pm me.
-Andy

Discobiscuits


quality posts: 1 Private Messages Discobiscuits
Andy47240 wrote:I would love to know how you did the swirlys. Very awesome. Maybe you could pm me.
-Andy


kls, this is your best shirt by far! i'd say top 4

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
NotAGirl wrote:wow. these fish really get around huh?

http://www.designbyhumans.com/vote/detail/5165


Thanks NotAGirl. Looks like the trolls are already making their presence. The other design, you might notice is my own. Although similar in color and design, the are not the same fish. Each sketch was drawn separately. Placement and size is also completely different and the other shirt is not available for sale. In fact, it is set to expire next week.

So, I see no conflict with entering this design as it is different, the other is not available for sale and the other is not likely to be printed in the 60 day DBH hold on the design.

I know this is an attempt to remove this entry from the fog, but it's a very sad commentary on the direction these forums are taking. Woot needs to disallow posts from obvious aliases. They do nothing but bring down morale.

Edit: For those concerned: Although the designs are not the same fish and were created with similar techniques and colors using two different sketches, I have written to Jason at DBH and asked him to remove my design from the DBH site. It wasn't going to get printed within the next 4 days (it didn't have enough votes).

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Andy47240 wrote:I would love to know how you did the swirlys. Very awesome. Maybe you could pm me.
-Andy


The were created with a brush using a tablet with pressure-sensitivity.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
sailstud25 wrote:Awesome colors, and loving the koi!

I posted this in Cho's wave thread, but you may be more likely to see it in your own shirt: can you pm me and explain how to put an image like your "vote ads" online to put into your sig since doesn't it require a url of the image? Also, I've noticed the tinyurl addresses before, but how do you do that too?

Thanks!


There is a URL for the image. It's hosted at photobucket. Then, I convert the image URL to a smaller-sized string by using the tinyurl site. Once you have the derby URL and the image URL, use the following format to modify the signature box under 'Your Account':

{url=http://tinyurl.com/3xkzuw}{img}http://tinyurl.com/2s4gnu{/img}{/url}

But, change the http addresses to your links, and change all the brackets from "{ }" to "[ ]" and it should work.

Be aware that it can take several minutes for the changes to show up when you first modify your profile under "Your Account". Give it a few minutes to let the changes propagate through the system.

Hopefully that will help. Feel free to PM me if you still have a question.

tiaerman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tiaerman
klswoot wrote:There is a URL for the image. It's hosted at photobucket. Then, I convert the image URL to a smaller-sized string by using the tinyurl site. Once you have the derby URL and the image URL, use the following format to modify the signature box under 'Your Account':

{url=http://tinyurl.com/3xkzuw}{img}http://tinyurl.com/2s4gnu{/img}{/url}

But, change the http addresses to your links, and change all the brackets from "{ }" to "[ ]" and it should work.

Be aware that it can take several minutes for the changes to show up when you first modify your profile under "Your Account". Give it a few minutes to let the changes propagate through the system.

Hopefully that will help. Feel free to PM me if you still have a question.


This helped me. I think i got it to work but I guess this post will tell. Thanks for the tip! Now I just need to figure out how to make my thumbnail small enough to show up entirely in the signature. Any suggestions?

Awesome design by the way! That is of course how I found this post in the first place so I didn't want to forget offer you my congrats on such a cool shirt design! GMV.

There are 10 types of people: those who know binary, and those who don't.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
tiaerman wrote:This helped me. I think i got it to work but I guess this post will tell. Thanks for the tip! Now I just need to figure out how to make my thumbnail small enough to show up entirely in the signature. Any suggestions?

Awesome design by the way! That is of course how I found this post in the first place so I didn't want to forget offer you my congrats on such a cool shirt design! GMV.


Glad the post helped you as well. My pictures are 1.5 inch squares. I wouldn't go much bigger, or it may not show up well in the signature with the scroll bar.

Kesrael


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Kesrael
Re: Swimming Koi


I like it. If it makes it (I voted for it!) I'll buy it.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Kesrael wrote:I like it. If it makes it (I voted for it!) I'll buy it.


Thank you! Boy the entries are falling in and out of the fog right now.

parkermc


quality posts: 23 Private Messages parkermc
NotAGirl wrote:wow. these fish really get around huh?

http://www.designbyhumans.com/vote/detail/5165


Didn't klswoot do an awesome job with both of those designs? Lucky for us, there's no conflict with DBH and we have a good chance of getting this fantastic creation on a t-shirt next week.

Thanks for spotlighting just what a great artist we have here!

heartluce


quality posts: 10 Private Messages heartluce
Re: Swimming Koi


Very nice design kls. One of my favorites of yours! I often use this style in my abstracts and it looks great on the black! Good luck this derby.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
heartluce wrote:Very nice design kls. One of my favorites of yours! I often use this style in my abstracts and it looks great on the black! Good luck this derby.


Thanks Heartluce. Wow! Given your background as an abstract artist, that's especially nice to hear! It's going to be a tough derby, though. A lot of amazing entries and it's only been 5 hours since the voting 'gates' opened. The weekend usually brings quite a few great late entries. I don't think anyone will be able to catch up with Zenne's entry. That one is astoundingly beautiful!

tiaerman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tiaerman
klswoot wrote:Glad the post helped you as well. My pictures are 1.5 inch squares. I wouldn't go much bigger, or it may not show up well in the signature with the scroll bar.


I know this probably sounds amateurish, but I'm not sure how to make the picture smaller so I don't get the scroll bar signature. I tried resizing it in paint but it messes up the picture some because it has to throwout pixels. Any suggestions? Maybe you could pm me. Thanks for your help.

There are 10 types of people: those who know binary, and those who don't.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
tiaerman wrote:I know this probably sounds amateurish, but I'm not sure how to make the picture smaller so I don't get the scroll bar signature. I tried resizing it in paint but it messes up the picture some because it has to throwout pixels. Any suggestions? Maybe you could pm me. Thanks for your help.


It looks like you got it to work. Did you do something after this post? Good luck with your first entry. It's very cute!

heartluce


quality posts: 10 Private Messages heartluce
klswoot wrote:Thanks Heartluce. Wow! Given your background as an abstract artist, that's especially nice to hear! It's going to be a tough derby, though. A lot of amazing entries and it's only been 5 hours since the voting 'gates' opened. The weekend usually brings quite a few great late entries. I don't think anyone will be able to catch up with Zenne's entry. That one is astoundingly beautiful!


I suppose I am partial because this looks most like an abstract painting to me while still retaining its great design as a t-shirt. Some abstract t designs aren't as well-composed imho. I'm also partial to the color scheme and placement - the flash of color against the black (I love black ts). This for me is a case where painting perfectly meshes with design. Great work!

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
heartluce wrote:I suppose I am partial because this looks most like an abstract painting to me while still retaining its great design as a t-shirt. Some abstract t designs aren't as well-composed imho. I'm also partial to the color scheme and placement - the flash of color against the black (I love black ts). This for me is a case where painting perfectly meshes with design. Great work!


Heartluce- You might want to look at artrage.com . I bought the software, but I don't know if I can get the techniques to work for a 6-spot color design like on woot. A lot of the features have gradients included in their 'application'. But, you can mimic airbrushing, palette knives, paintbrushes, pencil, charcoal and more. Feels more like painting on canvas. Right now, my daughter uses it more than me, but I'm trying to learn how it works. You might also enjoy it!

sailstud25


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sailstud25
klswoot wrote:Glad the post helped you as well. My pictures are 1.5 inch squares. I wouldn't go much bigger, or it may not show up well in the signature with the scroll bar.


Thanks a lot for the answers, and also glad to see it helped someone else as well... I had found the code thanks to woot, but your photobucket and tinyurl info is greatly appreciated (as sad as it is that they weren't obvious before).

p.s. I'm torn between which of your koi designs I like better. They're both awesome!

Hmm, just went in for 3 Randoms, when I haven't bought any shirts lately (although still checking frequently) so what are the chances of liking them!?! Oh well, couldn't pass up the mystery!
...a number of shirts on teetrade.com

narkus


quality posts: 0 Private Messages narkus
Re: Swimming Koi


Kristen, this is beautiful : )


klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
narkus wrote:Kristen, this is beautiful : )

Thanks Narkus. I really appreciate it!

You know I love your signature and how you have all the tshirts next to each other. It looks so good. It really makes me want to make a quilt out of the designs. I tell you...if woot wanted to send me a pile of their rejected shirts, I'd make a quilt for me and one to auction off for charity. I bet it would be a huge hit! Your signature makes all the designs look so neat one beside the other!

AlexIAm


quality posts: 4 Private Messages AlexIAm
klswoot wrote:Thanks NotAGirl. Looks like the trolls are already making their presence. The other design, you might notice is my own. Although similar in color and design, the are not the same fish. Each sketch was drawn separately. Placement and size is also completely different and the other shirt is not available for sale. In fact, it is set to expire next week.

<more justifiable defense>


You tell em kls... this shirt is beautiful. GMV


>insert funny quote here<

heartluce


quality posts: 10 Private Messages heartluce
klswoot wrote:Heartluce- You might want to look at artrage.com . I bought the software, but I don't know if I can get the techniques to work for a 6-spot color design like on woot. A lot of the features have gradients included in their 'application'. But, you can mimic airbrushing, palette knives, paintbrushes, pencil, charcoal and more. Feels more like painting on canvas. Right now, my daughter uses it more than me, but I'm trying to learn how it works. You might also enjoy it!


Thanks kls. Looks very interesting and not too pricey! :D

lunartan


quality posts: 1 Private Messages lunartan
Re: Swimming Koi

those are some agile & good lookin' koi! great design - GMV!

tiaerman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tiaerman
klswoot wrote:Boy the entries are falling in and out of the fog right now.

No kidding! I am definately torn though between this one and SkekTek's sponge shirt. They are two totally different ideas obviously and two totally different styles but they are both so awesome! I think that is why I enjoy Woot so much. Thanks Woot!

sailstud25 wrote:p.s. I'm torn between which of your koi designs I like better. They're both awesome!

There is more than one koi design? *is confused...*

klswoot wrote:It looks like you got it to work. Did you do something after this post? Good luck with your first entry. It's very cute!

Actually, I don't think I did anything after that post. Before the post i edited the picture on photobucket and made it thumbnail size. Then when I posted again and the picture wasn't thumbnail I was confused and thought it didn't work. I guess it took a while for something to be updated so that it would show the right size. If I took the text out of my sig then it wouldn't be scroll. Unfortunately I really like that quote. .

Also, thanks for the complement! I don't think it has a chance against all the other great entries but I'm glad to know that someone liked it. I have set a goal of getting 15 votes. I think that is reasonable with the time that is left, and it may be an undershot of what the design is really going to do. I didn't want to set too high of a goal though so 15 is the magic number for now .

There are 10 types of people: those who know binary, and those who don't.

mandraque


quality posts: 0 Private Messages mandraque

i like the DBH design better. I would buy that one. This one, while nice and all, just doesnt seemed proportioned to me. My brain doesnt click when i see it, but it is really nice.

goldfishinapicklejar


quality posts: 0 Private Messages goldfishinapicklejar
Re: Swimming Koi


this hurts my eyes.

narkus


quality posts: 0 Private Messages narkus
klswoot wrote:Thanks Narkus. I really appreciate it!

You know I love your signature and how you have all the tshirts next to each other. It looks so good. It really makes me want to make a quilt out of the designs. I tell you...if woot wanted to send me a pile of their rejected shirts, I'd make a quilt for me and one to auction off for charity. I bet it would be a huge hit! Your signature makes all the designs look so neat one beside the other!


My sig "collection" needs to be updated--need boyfriend to do it : ) A quilt of woot shirts would be the best!!!!!! By the way, I remember and really liked the DBH one, but I like this better and need a black woot!! so stay in the fog. I can't believe that lame ass tried to call you out on your own design. I can't believe some of the jerks on here. I can't wait to have you hanging on my wall too and will be getting with you soon on that : ) Great designs as always!!!!


klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


narkus wrote:My sig "collection" needs to be updated--need boyfriend to do it : ) A quilt of woot shirts would be the best!!!!!!
...

Great designs as always!!!!


I know! A Shirt.Woot quilt would be awesome. Great idea for the woot misprints. Send them my way, please! I'd definitely do something for charity!

Thanks for the comments on the koi design.

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
Re: Swimming Koi


Frankly, I really think this is not good at all.

It doesn't even look like fish - just white things with orange and black on them.

It looks unfinished.

The star swirlies look like a lazy PS paintbrush thrown in for I don't know what. They have no purpose. why are they stars?

placement is bad.

I just don't understand this. And what annoys me most is KLS is better than this...you just took a dbh design and threw some star swirlies on it. Why are they there? what is there purpose? WHAT IS IT? Just another rehash of the top right "abstract" stuff ad infinitum.

Lastly, black is a bad choice for the design itself. I see all this gushing over it, but I just don't understand. It feels all so forced and just not thought out at all. Makes me sad when there is so much awesome in this derby finally.

Andy47240


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Andy47240
brizz wrote:Frankly, I really think this is not good at all.

It doesn't even look like fish - just white things with orange and black on them.

It looks unfinished.

The star swirlies look like a lazy PS paintbrush thrown in for I don't know what. They have no purpose. why are they stars?

placement is bad.

I just don't understand this. And what annoys me most is KLS is better than this...you just took a dbh design and threw some star swirlies on it. Why are they there? what is there purpose? WHAT IS IT? Just another rehash of the top right "abstract" stuff ad infinitum.

Lastly, black is a bad choice for the design itself. I see all this gushing over it, but I just don't understand. It feels all so forced and just not thought out at all. Makes me sad when there is so much awesome in this derby finally.

It looks awesome.
Great Fish.
Star swirlies are incredible.
Great placement.
Most excellent design.
I hope it finishes top 3.

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
Andy47240 wrote:It looks awesome.
Great Fish.
Star swirlies are incredible.
Great placement.
Most excellent design.
I hope it finishes top 3.


star swirlies are "incredible?" Really? why?

mehron


quality posts: 1 Private Messages mehron

My top pick for this derby. I hope it gets printed. I'd buy 2 in an instant. Very beautiful layout, design, colors, everything. I am a big fan. Good luck!

tiaerman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tiaerman

How do I submit an Inkscape file? As best I can tell Inkscape does not allow me to save it with file extension jpeg, gif or png.. What do I do? Thanks for your help.

There are 10 types of people: those who know binary, and those who don't.

afb264


quality posts: 0 Private Messages afb264
Andy47240 wrote:It looks awesome.
Great Fish.
Star swirlies are incredible.
Great placement.
Most excellent design.
I hope it finishes top 3.


I agree. Sure, stars can be kitchy, but the swirlies give it a sense of motion and waves. And the fact that the fish themselves are abstract gives one the sense of looking down at them as they're swimming. This is the first shirt in the fog that I've really liked in a while.

lanpartyz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages lanpartyz
Re: Swimming Koi


I will own this if it gets printed!!!! NICE JOB!

tiaerman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tiaerman
tiaerman wrote:How do I submit an Inkscape file? As best I can tell Inkscape does not allow me to save it with file extension jpeg, gif or png.. What do I do? Thanks for your help.


Nevermind. I figured it out . How bout my new design? Add a comment and let me know what you think. While your at it, my girlfriend's design is cute and nerdy . Thanks again for all your help and good luck in the fog!

There are 10 types of people: those who know binary, and those who don't.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Wow Brizz! You're amazing. There's clearly no pleasing you. You were extremely negative about me last week and now again this week even though my entries are entirely different.

These fish are not from my dbh design at all. They are two completely different designs drawn from two totally different sketches. They were created with the same techniques as I would use if I were actually going to use a brush on canvas. They are not meant to look photorealistic....none of my work is photorealistic. They are meant to look like an abstract painting....like they are moving in the water with broad brushstrokes much like how an artist would paint on canvas.

The streaming of stars gives the movement of the fish and the water pattern. Black or navy seemed to be the best choice to make the colors show up. I needed the black from the shirt color for the black on the fish to keep the 6 colors. The addition of the light blue are the shadows on the fish when submerged in water. The fish are drawn with movement and fluidity to make them look like they are swimming in the water. This may be what you call unfinished, but the design looks exactly as I wanted it to look. I wouldn't change a thing.

Like someone else said, it is created like an abstract painting as if one was looking down into the water from above and the way you might see fish circling when swimming freely.

KLS is better than this? I don't think so. I'm actually quite proud of this design and think it is one of my best designs that also shows a painterly side.

As always, you are free to disagree, but I think it is clear that I am unable to satisfy whatever bar you have set for me. I'm proud of everything that I've created on shirt.woot.

I know that you are bashing my design in the hope one of Cho's gets printed or the River man gets printed. You've been a vocal advocate of those works. Just wished you wouldn't try to knock others just to make room for the designs you like.

Planting the seed of doubt seems like something you like to do and I doubt I can convince you to stop.

Before you respond, would you kindly read the PM that I sent you. Thank you.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
afb264 wrote:I agree. Sure, stars can be kitchy, but the swirlies give it a sense of motion and waves. And the fact that the fish themselves are abstract gives one the sense of looking down at them as they're swimming. This is the first shirt in the fog that I've really liked in a while.


Thank you so much. This is EXACTLY what I was trying to achieve with this design.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
mehron wrote:My top pick for this derby. I hope it gets printed. I'd buy 2 in an instant. Very beautiful layout, design, colors, everything. I am a big fan. Good luck!


Thanks Mehron and Andy. I appreciate the support.

JohnQ118


quality posts: 2 Private Messages JohnQ118
tiaerman wrote:This helped me. I think i got it to work ...

you can also use this site: http://tinypic.com/ for images. That's what I went to for my sig pics instead of tinyurl.
You upload images from your own PC so they don't yet need to be online somewhere. (But, Don't forget to check Add to my favorites or you'll lose it later! )

wOOt! 1st woot:20-AUG’05 |

JohnQ118


quality posts: 2 Private Messages JohnQ118
JohnQ118 wrote:you can also use this site: http://tinypic.com/ for images. That's what I went to for my sig pics instead of tinyurl.
You upload images from your own PC so they don't yet need to be online somewhere. (But, Don't forget to check Add to my favorites or you'll lose it later! )


BTW, first in-the-running Derby Design I've voted for in a while, really hope this makes it. My wife passed by and said "nice colors" and she rarely likes me to buy, or buy her, shirt.woots

wOOt! 1st woot:20-AUG’05 |

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


JohnQ118 wrote:BTW, first in-the-running Derby Design I've voted for in a while, really hope this makes it. My wife passed by and said "nice colors" and she rarely likes me to buy, or buy her, shirt.woots



Thanks John! (And thanks to your wife too!). I'm impressed that you've bought 32 shirts too. Wow!

Thanks for the advice on tinypic as well. I haven't used that one, but you're right. Sounds like that would also work.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Ahhhh...I think these fish are sinking. From the shirtderby stats site, I suspect this one is in fourth place just a vote or two before the Sponge. The site shows Jaden, James and I neck in neck, but I think Jaden has been in the hotness quite a bit more than James' waves and my fish.

The sponge is going to suck us up. Who's on fourth and what will be the magic number?

aaa6112


quality posts: 0 Private Messages aaa6112
Re: Swimming Koi


Looks like this derby is gonna burn a hole in my pocket. So many fantastic designs, this being one of them. All the best, Kls!

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


aaa6112 wrote:Looks like this derby is gonna burn a hole in my pocket. So many fantastic designs, this being one of them. All the best, Kls!



Thanks Triple-A. I think you're right. There are a lot of great entries this week. I'm thrilled to be in the fog, but it may be short-lived. There are just too many great designs. I foresee buying all three of the winning designs as well. I'd love to be one of them, but I think whichever three win, they'll be great shirts!

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
klswoot wrote:Wow Brizz! You're amazing. There's clearly no pleasing you. You were extremely negative about me last week and now again this week even though my entries are entirely different.

These fish are not from my dbh design at all. They are two completely different designs drawn from two totally different sketches. They were created with the same techniques as I would use if I were actually going to use a brush on canvas. They are not meant to look photorealistic....none of my work is photorealistic. They are meant to look like an abstract painting....like they are moving in the water with broad brushstrokes much like how an artist would paint on canvas.

The streaming of stars gives the movement of the fish and the water pattern. Black or navy seemed to be the best choice to make the colors show up. I needed the black from the shirt color for the black on the fish to keep the 6 colors. The addition of the light blue are the shadows on the fish when submerged in water. The fish are drawn with movement and fluidity to make them look like they are swimming in the water. This may be what you call unfinished, but the design looks exactly as I wanted it to look. I wouldn't change a thing.

Like someone else said, it is created like an abstract painting as if one was looking down into the water from above and the way you might see fish circling when swimming freely.

KLS is better than this? I don't think so. I'm actually quite proud of this design and think it is one of my best designs that also shows a painterly side.

As always, you are free to disagree, but I think it is clear that I am unable to satisfy whatever bar you have set for me. I'm proud of everything that I've created on shirt.woot.

I know that you are bashing my design in the hope one of Cho's gets printed or the River man gets printed. You've been a vocal advocate of those works. Just wished you wouldn't try to knock others just to make room for the designs you like.

Planting the seed of doubt seems like something you like to do and I doubt I can convince you to stop.

Before you respond, would you kindly read the PM that I sent you. Thank you.


I wasn't bashing....I was pointing out what I don't "get" about the popularity of it all. For what it's worth, i really like the underwater friends design you did and voted for it. It's not personal at all...I just don't get the popularity of this particular one. that's all. *shrug*

kazukih


quality posts: 0 Private Messages kazukih
brizz wrote:Frankly, I really think this is not good at all.

It doesn't even look like fish - just white things with orange and black on them.

It looks unfinished.

The star swirlies look like a lazy PS paintbrush thrown in for I don't know what. They have no purpose. why are they stars?

placement is bad.

I just don't understand this. And what annoys me most is KLS is better than this...you just took a dbh design and threw some star swirlies on it. Why are they there? what is there purpose? WHAT IS IT? Just another rehash of the top right "abstract" stuff ad infinitum.

Lastly, black is a bad choice for the design itself. I see all this gushing over it, but I just don't understand. It feels all so forced and just not thought out at all. Makes me sad when there is so much awesome in this derby finally.


Wow Brizz. You sure do love to hate. Don't get me wrong, (no offense to kls) I absolutely hate this design but you need to lighten up dood. You talk a lot of shillelagh about everyones designs. You can cry a river all you want but the fact is that people like these designs so you need to build a bridge and get the Harvey Wallbanger over it. If it wins don't buy it. Woot needs to toss these forums they just cause drama. If not, I'll be happy to bash and put down your next design with all my fury just like you do to everyone else's. And here's your ever so famous trademark smiley to lighten this slap to the face.

peppersagooddog


quality posts: 0 Private Messages peppersagooddog
brizz wrote:I wasn't bashing....I was pointing out what I don't "get" about the popularity of it all. For what it's worth, i really like the underwater friends design you did and voted for it. It's not personal at all...I just don't get the popularity of this particular one. that's all. *shrug*



holy long defence batman! i'm gonna quote you brizz, just cause its easier than quoting what you quoted...
for my part, i liked the color combo here. and thats the end of it. i liked the DBH shirt way better and i comletely agree that this looks less finished, not abstract but a half done still life. the star/swirly/w.t.f ever things are the main reason i didn't give it a vote. i really like alot of your stuff Kristen, but i think brizz is right. you are capable of expanding your abilities further than rehashing the swirly thing in a new way each week. i've seen it in every derby i can remember since the patterns, which you should have gotten printed in. each week it gets less appealing, seriously. don't pidgeon hole yourself so.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
kazukih wrote:Wow Brizz. You sure do love to hate. Don't get me wrong, (no offense to kls) I absolutely hate this design but you need to lighten up dood. You talk a lot of shillelagh about everyones designs. You can cry a river all you want but the fact is that people like these designs so you need to build a bridge and get the Harvey Wallbanger over it. If it wins don't buy it. Woot needs to toss these forums they just cause drama. If not, I'll be happy to bash and put down your next design with all my fury just like you do to everyone else's. And here's your ever so famous trademark smiley to lighten this slap to the face.



Hey... how were you allowed to say 'hate' without a woot filter. Something must have changed. For some reason your dislike for my design was actually easier to take. Thanks...I guess.

As for peppers comments:
I felt the design needed the swirly motion in the water to aid in the feeling of the fish swimming. I definitely don't view these anything remotely like the 'swirlies' in my other designs. In my eye, this is totally 100% an art-related entry. Nothing like the contemporary entries that are a collaged abstract. Other than the one background brushstroke, this design is entirely hand-drawn with tablet (no reference photos, no copying, no stealing ... the things people should be worrying about). It was meant to look like it done in a sketch style to aid in the feeling of movement with the fish.

I honestly believe I do challenge myself each week and offer quite a wide variety of designs. I really do try.

geekfactor12


quality posts: 11 Private Messages geekfactor12
klswoot wrote:These fish are not from my dbh design at all. They are two completely different designs drawn from two totally different sketches. They were created with the same techniques as I would use if I were actually going to use a brush on canvas. They are not meant to look photorealistic....none of my work is photorealistic. They are meant to look like an abstract painting....like they are moving in the water with broad brushstrokes much like how an artist would paint on canvas.

The streaming of stars gives the movement of the fish and the water pattern. Black or navy seemed to be the best choice to make the colors show up. I needed the black from the shirt color for the black on the fish to keep the 6 colors. The addition of the light blue are the shadows on the fish when submerged in water. The fish are drawn with movement and fluidity to make them look like they are swimming in the water. This may be what you call unfinished, but the design looks exactly as I wanted it to look. I wouldn't change a thing.

Like someone else said, it is created like an abstract painting as if one was looking down into the water from above and the way you might see fish circling when swimming freely.


I actually kind of see where Brizz is coming from on this- I'm only somewhat familiar with your koi design at DBH (I think I saw it once) and when I saw this, I assumed it was the same one (or constructed from the same elements). I apologize if I sold you short!

Maybe my definitions are a bit off, but I actually think it's closer to realism than abstraction. And that's a huge plus for the design to me, because I prefer things with some grounding in reality ;)

klswoot wrote:As always, you are free to disagree, but I think it is clear that I am unable to satisfy whatever bar you have set for me. I'm proud of everything that I've created on shirt.woot.

I know that you are bashing my design in the hope one of Cho's gets printed or the River man gets printed. You've been a vocal advocate of those works. Just wished you wouldn't try to knock others just to make room for the designs you like.

Planting the seed of doubt seems like something you like to do and I doubt I can convince you to stop.


I think you're misinterpreting Brizz. I've always seen him as a guy who is really interested in design, and when he sees something worth improving, he's very good about letting the designer know exactly what to improve. I value his comments because hearing from the critics (even when it's a minority opinion, as it seems to be in this case) tells me a lot more than hearing five people say they'd wear it.

Besides, while people love to say that negative posts hurt the vote count, I feel like every derby I see the opposite happen. The most controversial entries seem to soar up the hotness, probably because of their increased visibility in the forums. If Brizz's goal was really to sabotage others to get more attention and votes on his favorites, I think his actions would be totally different- he'd have links in his sig for his favorites and he'd post comments all over the site. That's the only successful method I've seen of getting votes in the derby.

It's great to be proud of your work, but I hope you're also striving to improve. Despite having some limited success here and there in the derby and on Woot, it's always in the back of my head to try to make a design so great it finally silences the critics ;) Maybe it's an impossible goal, but it's fun to aim for.

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
kazukih wrote:Wow Brizz. You sure do love to hate. Don't get me wrong, (no offense to kls) I absolutely hate this design but you need to lighten up dood. You talk a lot of shillelagh about everyones designs. You can cry a river all you want but the fact is that people like these designs so you need to build a bridge and get the Harvey Wallbanger over it. If it wins don't buy it. Woot needs to toss these forums they just cause drama. If not, I'll be happy to bash and put down your next design with all my fury just like you do to everyone else's. And here's your ever so famous trademark smiley to lighten this slap to the face.


I don't love to hate...show me one instance of unfair or "hateful" criticism of the koi? I stand by everything I said....and kept my comments to the structure and design of the shirt.

Frankly, I find comments like yours sad - if people are only allowed to compliment entries with a lot of votes this place will get real boring and stagnate real quick. what's wrong with expressing an opinion? not buying something is a pretty weak form of commentary. and it's besides the point. I'm not crying, nor am I in any way personally vested in the koi winning or losing. far worse has won, and will in the future. You are the one that needs to get the hell over it....

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
klswoot wrote:Nothing like the contemporary entries that are a collaged abstract. Other than the one background brushstroke, this design is entirely hand-drawn with tablet (


two things:

This is not "abstract" - you are going for realistic fish...that is the opposite of abstract. You throw that around a lot, but rarely correctly.

Second - and this is an honest question: Are you saying you drew each of the star elements of the swirlies?

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
geekfactor12 wrote:I think you're misinterpreting Brizz. I've always seen him as a guy who is really interested in design, and when he sees something worth improving, he's very good about letting the designer know exactly what to improve. I value his comments because hearing from the critics (even when it's a minority opinion, as it seems to be in this case) tells me a lot more than hearing five people say they'd wear it.

Besides, while people love to say that negative posts hurt the vote count, I feel like every derby I see the opposite happen. The most controversial entries seem to soar up the hotness, probably because of their increased visibility in the forums. If Brizz's goal was really to sabotage others to get more attention and votes on his favorites, I think his actions would be totally different- he'd have links in his sig for his favorites and he'd post comments all over the site. That's the only successful method I've seen of getting votes in the derby.



this is spot on btw: thanks gf

so called "bashing" of designs never does anything but inspire people to vote...so trust me (and gf) when we say that it is not an attempt to dissuade voters. They will vote anyway, and I know that. I don't lobby for votes one way or another, just try to offer constructive and honest critiques - good and bad.

how much would it suck if all anyone ever posted here was "this rules, GMV!"???

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
geekfactor12 wrote:I think you're misinterpreting Brizz. I've always seen him as a guy who is really interested in design, and when he sees something worth improving, he's very good about letting the designer know exactly what to improve. I value his comments because hearing from the critics (even when it's a minority opinion, as it seems to be in this case) tells me a lot more than hearing five people say they'd wear it.

Besides, while people love to say that negative posts hurt the vote count, I feel like every derby I see the opposite happen. The most controversial entries seem to soar up the hotness, probably because of their increased visibility in the forums. If Brizz's goal was really to sabotage others to get more attention and votes on his favorites, I think his actions would be totally different- he'd have links in his sig for his favorites and he'd post comments all over the site. That's the only successful method I've seen of getting votes in the derby.

It's great to be proud of your work, but I hope you're also striving to improve. Despite having some limited success here and there in the derby and on Woot, it's always in the back of my head to try to make a design so great it finally silences the critics ;) Maybe it's an impossible goal, but it's fun to aim for.


You're probably right. But, it's a difficult week for me and it's tough to hear 'you're better than this' two weeks in a row when I'm actually quite proud of the designs I submit on Woot. I've only been doing this type of online 'art' since late October and I'm pretty proud of what I've been able to do. I do appreciate hearing that people think I can do better, but it's a learning process and it takes time. It's hard to spend so much time on designs to have them so quickly deemed a 'poor design'.

As for the dbh design...it is set to expire in about 6 days. I wrote to Jason and asked him remove the design. It does not have the votes to get printed, so there really shouldn't be an issue. Plus, they aren't the same fish....just look at their shape and their fins. They were drawn separately from this design they are HUGE on the shirt with entirely different placement. Even if both were to get printed, they would look entirely different on the shirt. The only similarities are in the technique and the colors. But, Jason will remove it tomorrow. So, it's only an issue for those who want to make it one.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
brizz wrote:two things:

This is not "abstract" - you are going for realistic fish...that is the opposite of abstract. You throw that around a lot, but rarely correctly.

Second - and this is an honest question: Are you saying you drew each of the star elements of the swirlies?


No. Brizz. I said 'other than the one background brushstroke' I drew everything with a tablet. The background brushstroke are the stars. If you read all the comments under my design, you'll see that I answered Andy's question about the stars. They were created with a pressure sensitive pen on a tablet using a star brush.

You even said the fish don't look like fish....so they must be abstract. They are certainly not photorealistic. Find me a koi that looks like this and I'll take back my word 'abstract'. Heartluce is an abstract artist and she referred to these as abstract.

I'm the artist....allow me the respect to describe the design the way I see it. Don't put words in my mouth and say "this is not 'abstract - you are going for realistic fish'.

Why not just allow the designers to post their designs without some imaginary 'bar' of what you deem quality, or worthy of your vote.

I'm very proud of this design. Would I love for everyone to like it sure? But, I know that's not going to happen. But I just don't understand why those who dislike something have to be so vocal about it and in a mean-spirited way. I've posted several times what gets my vote and what doesn't get my vote, but I've always been respectful. I don't always see this in the forum.

Andy47240


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Andy47240
klswoot wrote: But, Jason will remove it tomorrow. So, it's only an issue for those who want to make it one.

Are you seriously removing this design? I have to be reading this wrong.
Or do you mean the DBH design?

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Andy47240 wrote:Are you seriously removing this design? I have to be reading this wrong.


No. Jason at DBH will remove the other design that uses similar colors. It was set to expire in 7 days and only has 27 votes. DBH wouldn't have printed it anyway. But if you look at my signature or the link that I posted, the fish aren't the same. Placement and overall appearance on the shirt are entirely different and nothing has been made commercially available. Given that it was going to expire anyway, I just asked Jason to remove it early to avoid any conflict.

It would be a true shame if people tattled on a DBH design that I actually created...rather than worrying about other designs that blatantly copy another person's work.

aaa6112


quality posts: 0 Private Messages aaa6112
brizz wrote:Frankly, I really think this is not good at all.

It doesn't even look like fish - just white things with orange and black on them.

It looks unfinished.

The star swirlies look like a lazy PS paintbrush thrown in for I don't know what. They have no purpose. why are they stars?

placement is bad.

I just don't understand this. And what annoys me most is KLS is better than this...you just took a dbh design and threw some star swirlies on it. Why are they there? what is there purpose? WHAT IS IT? Just another rehash of the top right "abstract" stuff ad infinitum.

Lastly, black is a bad choice for the design itself. I see all this gushing over it, but I just don't understand. It feels all so forced and just not thought out at all. Makes me sad when there is so much awesome in this derby finally.


Frankly, I really think this is very good.

It doesn't look TOTALLY like a fish; Kls had mentioned that "My hope was that the result would look like you were looking down upon the fish as they are swimming and the blue shadow on their body from the water as they swim freely." You look through water, there's refraction, which distorts the way the fish looks...so yes its not perfect. I give credit to Kls for not making them 100% real, makes it easier to believe that they're being viewed from above the water.

I feel viewing them from above the water makes them look distorted; not unfinished.

The swirlies, I feel, are there for a purpose which Kls has repeatedly mentioned - the fish are swimming...not stationary.

Placement is NOT bad.

I am sorry you do not understand this.

Kls, you are a good designer.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
aaa6112 wrote:Frankly, I really think this is very good.

It doesn't look TOTALLY like a fish; Kls had mentioned that "My hope was that the result would look like you were looking down upon the fish as they are swimming and the blue shadow on their body from the water as they swim freely." You look through water, there's refraction, which distorts the way the fish looks...so yes its not perfect. I give credit to Kls for not making them 100% real, makes it easier to believe that they're being viewed from above the water.

I feel viewing them from above the water makes them look distorted; not unfinished.

The swirlies, I feel, are there for a purpose which Kls has repeatedly mentioned - the fish are swimming...not stationary.

Placement is NOT bad.

I am sorry you do not understand this.

Kls, you are a good designer.


Thanks Triple-A. I appreciate the support. Why does that post look vaguely familiar? Oh...yeah...now I know.

I don't know about you, but I think enough has been said about this design. Let's move on to another one. Zenne....we're coming for you.

superspryte


quality posts: 21 Private Messages superspryte
klswoot wrote:No. Brizz. I said 'other than the one background brushstroke' I drew everything with a tablet. The background brushstroke are the stars. If you read all the comments under my design, you'll see that I answered Andy's question about the stars. They were created with a pressure sensitive pen on a tablet using a star brush.

You even said the fish don't look like fish....so they must be abstract. They are certainly not photorealistic. Find me a koi that looks like this and I'll take back my word 'abstract'. Heartluce is an abstract artist and she referred to these as abstract.

I'm the artist....allow me the respect to describe the design the way I see it. Don't put words in my mouth and say "this is not 'abstract - you are going for realistic fish'.

Why not just allow the designers to post their designs without some imaginary 'bar' of what you deem quality, or worthy of your vote.

I'm very proud of this design. Would I love for everyone to like it sure? But, I know that's not going to happen. But I just don't understand why those who dislike something have to be so vocal about it and in a mean-spirited way. I've posted several times what gets my vote and what doesn't get my vote, but I've always been respectful. I don't always see this in the forum.

I think people are confusing abstract with non-objective, KLS. According to any art analysis I've ever seen, these are moderately abstract. They certainly aren't realist and because they *are* fish they aren't non-objective. ^_^ I like them.

w: 7 | t.w: 1 | h.w: 1 | s.w: 16 | w.w: 15 | so.w: 2

Patchitect


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Patchitect
Re: Swimming Koi


I want this to win, since i missed out on the canvas one, i need the Tee!!

heartluce


quality posts: 10 Private Messages heartluce
superspryte wrote:I think people are confusing abstract with non-objective, KLS. According to any art analysis I've ever seen, these are moderately abstract. They certain aren't realist and because they are* fish they aren't non-objective. ^_^ I like them.


I think it's very difficult to "define" art unless it's hanging in a museum and you can look to see what the "label" on it is. The fish are surely not in the style of realism and are in fact more abstract. Then again abstract art is not that easy to define in itself. Some abstract I would call more "pure abstract" as in Kandinsky or Pollock. There were subtle shifts in painting which occurred throughout art history from what I was taught. I would even go as far as to say there are elements of Fauvism in this design, but, hey, that's just me.

Patchitect


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Patchitect
heartluce wrote:I think it's very difficult to "define" art unless it's hanging in a museum and you can look to see what the "label" on it is. The fish are surely not in the style of realism and are in fact more abstract. Then again abstract art is not that easy to define in itself. Some abstract I would call more "pure abstract" as in Kandinsky or Pollock. There were subtle shifts in painting which occurred throughout art history from what I was taught. I would even go as far as to say there are elements of Fauvism in this design, but, hey, that's just me.


Despite the official "catagorization" of this work, i find it to be well done and on topic. It evokes the essence of the koi pond, the layering of the fish themselves, who are naturally abstract in their markings, and the effect that the motion of water has on their appearance. I don't think I'd have chosen the stars and dots to accentuate the piece, but thats artistic expression at its best. The navy is likewise very appropriate, as most koi ponds i've seen have had dark backgrounds to better highlight the living works of art that inhabit them. This is one of the better interpretations of a refined art form in graphic form that i've seen.

Personally, i'm glad that this derby has had a nice mix of both artistic and entertaining entries in the fog, rather then a rash of the same concept/execution.

superspryte


quality posts: 21 Private Messages superspryte
heartluce wrote:I think it's very difficult to "define" art unless it's hanging in a museum and you can look to see what the "label" on it is. The fish are surely not in the style of realism and are in fact more abstract. Then again abstract art is not that easy to define in itself. Some abstract I would call more "pure abstract" as in Kandinsky or Pollock. There were subtle shifts in painting which occurred throughout art history from what I was taught. I would even go as far as to say there are elements of Fauvism in this design, but, hey, that's just me.

Whereas I call Pollock non-objective. It's a more precise word I picked up from art professors because abstract has such a fluid definition now. ^_^

w: 7 | t.w: 1 | h.w: 1 | s.w: 16 | w.w: 15 | so.w: 2

heartluce


quality posts: 10 Private Messages heartluce
superspryte wrote:Whereas I call Pollock non-objective. It's a more precise word I picked up from art professors because abstract has such a fluid definition now. ^_^


I was mainly agreeing with you and still am ;-). Also with what Patch said above about the piece.

Patchitect


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Patchitect
heartluce wrote:I was mainly agreeing with you and still am ;-). Also with what Patch said above about the piece.


:-)

Personally, i'm against this whole obsession the human race has with categorizing everything so they can pigeonhole and comprehend their constructed and natural environment. Categorizing things is for those who are afraid of creating things. Creation and inspiration disregard categories in favor of expression.

heartluce


quality posts: 10 Private Messages heartluce
Patchitect wrote::-)

Personally, i'm against this whole obsession the human race has with categorizing everything so they can pigeonhole and comprehend their constructed and natural environment. Categorizing things is for those who are afraid of creating things. Creation and inspiration disregard categories in favor of expression.


I couldn't agree more. Also, what does it matter what style it is?

superspryte


quality posts: 21 Private Messages superspryte
heartluce wrote:I was mainly agreeing with you and still am ;-). Also with what Patch said above about the piece.

I wasn't sure but I figured it was an opportune time to clarify non-objective. ^_^

w: 7 | t.w: 1 | h.w: 1 | s.w: 16 | w.w: 15 | so.w: 2

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
heartluce wrote:I couldn't agree more. Also, what does it matter what style it is?


What style? Do you mean the objective, action-painted abstract expressionist fish served with a side of Fauvism. Thanks Heartluce, Spryte and Patch. I had fun reading the last few posts.

Attila- If you're reading this...I'm working on your painting right now...while catching up with the Oscars on Tivo!

Patchitect


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Patchitect
klswoot wrote:What style? Do you mean the objective, action-painted abstract expressionist fish served with a side of Fauvism. Thanks Heartluce, Spryte and Patch. I had fun reading the last few posts.

Attila- If you're reading this...I'm working on your painting right now...while catching up with the Oscars on Tivo!


Mmmmm fauvism... love it - it really clears the sinuses...

Can i get my expressionism in a maki? and my objectivism on a negiri?

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot

Patch- Thanks for your comments on the design. Just wanted to point out that the shirt is the black tshirt...not the navy. I thought about navy, but I needed the sections on the fish to be black, so I chose the black tee.

Just wanted to clarify this.

Patchitect


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Patchitect
klswoot wrote:Patch- Thanks for your comments on the design. Just wanted to point out that the shirt is the black tshirt...not the navy. I thought about navy, but I needed the sections on the shirt to be black, so I chose the black tee.

Just wanted to clarify this.


Yanno - my monitor is all kinds of screwed up.. Black, Navy and Brown all look the same, which is one reason i'm hesitant to design on those colors Might need to invest in more reliable EQ if i'm gonna keep this up.

Discobiscuits


quality posts: 1 Private Messages Discobiscuits

No Country for Old Men. Period.


oh yeah, this design owns btw kls. enjoy the 1st place victory!

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Discobiscuits wrote:No Country for Old Men. Period.


oh yeah, this design owns btw kls. enjoy the 1st place victory!


Yes. I'm all caught up now with the taped Oscars and yes... No Country for Old Men cleaned up. My husband's thrilled as he's from Spain and very much wanted Javier to win. First Spanish actor to win an Oscar. His speech was cute given how fast he had to talk.

Thanks Disco. But, I actually think I'm in third or fourth position. Zenne OWNS first place. Her design has been raking in the votes (deserved so). I think she may give you a run for your "cool breeze" money.

Also..on an aside....awesome dog picture. (Border Collie?) I did a series of agility dog paintings and I used Border Collies quite a bit. LOVE THEM!

Bryan818


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Bryan818
brizz wrote:star swirlies are "incredible?" Really? why?


i think the shirt looks great but the stars look like something i saw for free online... i'm not gonna take the time to find it cause i don't care... i hope you win, good luck kls

Please check it out

Andy47240


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Andy47240
Bryan818 wrote:i think the shirt looks great but the stars look like something i saw for free online... i'm not gonna take the time to find it cause i don't care... i hope you win, good luck kls

You won't find it.

parkermc


quality posts: 23 Private Messages parkermc
Bryan818 wrote:i think the shirt looks great but the stars look like something i saw for free online... i'm not gonna take the time to find it cause i don't care...


Andy47240 wrote:You won't find it.


No, he won't, but it was all about the insinuation, anyway. Some have proven they know exactly where to look for images to copy off the 'net, whereas kls is too talented to need that kind of boost. Her design is original.

Again, congrats on the success of your entry, kls. It's obviously a serious threat to finish in the fog.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
parkermc wrote:No, he won't, but it was all about the insinuation, anyway. Some have proven they know exactly where to look for images to copy off the 'net, whereas kls is too talented to need that kind of boost. Her design is original.

Again, congrats on the success of your entry, kls. It's obviously a serious threat to finish in the fog.


Thanks Andy and Parker. No. Nothing was copied for this design. I think Bryan means that the star brush stroke is available as a free download. Once you have the brushstroke as a tool, you can use a drawing tablet with pressure sensitive pen to create fine and thick lines by alternating the pressure on the pen. This is a great way to create the depth that I wanted to make the fish look like they were coming up from the dark of the sea and tie the fish into the overall shirt and use some of the negative space in the 16x20 space to my advantage.

Bryan818


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Bryan818
klswoot wrote:Thanks Andy and Parker. No. Nothing was copied for this design. I think Bryan means that the star brush stroke is available as a free download. Once you have the brushstroke as a tool, you can use a drawing tablet with pressure sensitive pen to create fine and thick lines by alternating the pressure on the pen. This is a great way to create the depth that I wanted to make the fish look like they were coming up from the dark of the sea and tie the fish into the overall shirt and use some of the negative space in the 16x20 space to my advantage.

yes. no insinuation.

Please check it out

KenSPT


quality posts: 0 Private Messages KenSPT
Re: Swimming Koi


Very cool shirt ...

crazylikecatfish


quality posts: 0 Private Messages crazylikecatfish
Re: Swimming Koi


Gives off that majestic feeling. Beautiful, just beautiful.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Thanks for keeping these guys in the running. I really appreciate it everybody.

Okay...I'm not a photochopper...but here's my weak attempt. (tshirt = black ...for illustrative purposes only...not to scale..yada yada yada.)







(I should hire cho, jaden or josephus for the photochops...they do a much better job than I.)

belean


quality posts: 0 Private Messages belean
Re: Swimming Koi


Déjà vu. remove silly poem, add silly fish.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
belean wrote:Déjà vu. remove silly poem, add silly fish.


You see what you want through tainted lenses. It would take a person stronger than I to try to sway your spiteful spirit and I wish not try.

Who is the 'silly' one between the two of us? Really? I write to you maturely using my own woot user id and not from one with zero woot purchases whose singular purpose is to be spiteful and rude.

note: Edited to show the error of my ways.

snarkygal


quality posts: 5 Private Messages snarkygal
klswoot wrote:You see what you want through tainted lenses. It would take a person stronger than I to try to sway your spiteful spirit and I wish not try.

Who is the 'silly' one between the two of us? Really? I write to you maturely using my own woot user id and not from one with zero woot purchases whose singular purpose is to be spiteful and rude.

Woot staff:
It would be in your best interest to disallow posts from zero purchase id's. They are, for the most part, created only to be disrespectful and rude.


I disagree because some of those zero purchase id's could be new wooters and taking away their ability to participate on the boards would chase them away from Woot. Suck it up Kristen, just ignore Belean, whoever that is.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
snarkygal wrote:I disagree because some of those zero purchase id's could be new wooters and taking away their ability to participate on the boards would chase them away from Woot. Suck it up Kristen, just ignore Belean, whoever that is.


You're right Snarky. But, I rarely see any positive posts from zero purchase id's. They seem to be aliases for the most part. Just makes you question their intent. But, you're right. Legitimate new users have every right to speak their mind.

FenStar


quality posts: 16 Private Messages FenStar
klswoot wrote:You're right Snarky. But, I rarely see any positive posts from zero purchase id's. They seem to be aliases for the most part. Just makes you question their intent. But, you're right. Legitimate new users have every right to speak their mind.

Or old users that are poor and can't afford to buy anything.

Still single, can't imagine why.

bluchez


quality posts: 3 Private Messages bluchez
belean wrote:Déjà vu. remove silly poem, add silly fish.


In kls's defense, this one does not look like the leap year one to me in the least. That isn't to say that the Quitter and Leap Year ones didn't look way too similar, but I think this one is unique.

no1


quality posts: 7 Private Messages no1
klswoot wrote:Woot staff:
It would be in your best interest to disallow posts from zero purchase id's. They are, for the most part, created only to be disrespectful and rude.


Ouch!

FenStar wrote:Or old users that are poor and can't afford to buy anything.


Ouch!

Mabe we're just picky and cheap.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
bluchez wrote:In kls's defense, this one does not look like the leap year one to me in the least. That isn't to say that the Quitter and Leap Year ones didn't look way too similar, but I think this one is unique.


Thanks for the support Bluchez. I appreciate it! Yes. I agree with your assessment that the Quitter and Leap Year looked alike. I mentioned underneath that one that I used the same layout for Leap Year because the Quitter was a late submission. (But, ultimately it didn't really matter as both never came near the top 3.) So, those will be shelved.

Thanks again!

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
no1 wrote:Ouch!

Mabe we're just picky and cheap.


No1 you've never bought a single shirt? I'm shocked. You can't even vote on your own cute veggies. Now that's just nuts. There must be one shirt that you absolutely have to have.....no? What about scurvy? Goes right along with the veggie theme?

geekfactor12


quality posts: 11 Private Messages geekfactor12
klswoot wrote:You're right Snarky. But, I rarely see any positive posts from zero purchase id's. They seem to be aliases for the most part. Just makes you question their intent. But, you're right. Legitimate new users have every right to speak their mind.


We have the exact opposite stereotype of zero woot people- I always seem to see positive posts, with recent join dates. So I always assume it's the artist, propping their own sub with comments.

Of course, all of this is fairly moot, since I don't think comments affect scoring much at all (except maybe in clear-cut cases of plagiarism).

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
geekfactor12 wrote:We have the exact opposite stereotype of zero woot people- I always seem to see positive posts, with recent join dates. So I always assume it's the artist, propping their own sub with comments.

Of course, all of this is fairly moot, since I don't think comments affect scoring much at all (except maybe in clear-cut cases of plagiarism).


Okay...Now I'm going to have to watch more carefully. I haven't noticed the posts that you mention GF....but they probably aren't as indelible as the more hurtful blatant alias ones. I'll keep a watch and make a mental tally.

Like you said, the majority of the voters probably don't read any of this.

superspryte


quality posts: 21 Private Messages superspryte
klswoot wrote:You're right Snarky. But, I rarely see any positive posts from zero purchase id's. They seem to be aliases for the most part. Just makes you question their intent. But, you're right. Legitimate new users have every right to speak their mind.

I can think of several who have good things to say. no1 and Andy are a pair that come to mind. There are of course others too. ^_^

w: 7 | t.w: 1 | h.w: 1 | s.w: 16 | w.w: 15 | so.w: 2

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
superspryte wrote:I can think of several who have good things to say. no1 and Andy are a pair that come to mind. There are of course others too. ^_^


I was thinking of the zero-purchase non-designers. No1 and Andy both contribute designs, so you know they aren't hiding behind an alias when they post their comments. But, yes....Andy's awesome too. Now ....we just have to get them to find a shirt they love and get the prestigious colored-box by their name.

superspryte


quality posts: 21 Private Messages superspryte
klswoot wrote:I was thinking of the zero-purchase non-designers. No1 and Andy both contribute designs, so you know they aren't hiding between an alias when they post their comments. But, yes....Andy's awesome too. Now ....we just have to get them to find a shirt they love and get the prestigious colored-box by their name.

While not a colorless box, here's something positive to see:

Carissima17 wrote:I want one of these so badly. It is so cute!


First post by that user, and it was directly below your post. ^_^

w: 7 | t.w: 1 | h.w: 1 | s.w: 16 | w.w: 15 | so.w: 2

Andy47240


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Andy47240
klswoot wrote:I was thinking of the zero-purchase non-designers. No1 and Andy both contribute designs, so you know they aren't hiding between an alias when they post their comments. But, yes....Andy's awesome too. Now ....we just have to get them to find a shirt they love and get the prestigious colored-box by their name.

Reason's for no purchases:
I have worked for a Screenprinting business for 14 years. I have T-shirts(free no less) jammed in my closet so tight I can barely get a hanger in sometimes.
I know I could purchase a non t-shirt item and get the voter rights, but I am extremelly reluctant to shop on-line using a credit card.
It doesn't really bother me that I can't vote other than the fact that I can't show an immediate +1 next to my design. I have to wait for someone to feel sorry for my pitiful +0 and give me a vote.
I would hope they would not ban non purchasers from the forum, because I like to visit every now and then.
-Andy

SailorButterfly


quality posts: 14 Private Messages SailorButterfly
Andy47240 wrote:I know I could purchase a non t-shirt item and get the voter rights, but I am extremelly reluctant to shop on-line using a credit card.


You could also use PayPal...would that make you feel better? It's supposed to be more secure. I've used PayPal since it was created and have never had a problem, but I HAVE had my debit card compromised before!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "Most Awesome Butterfly-Sailor Hybrid on Woot"

snarkygal


quality posts: 5 Private Messages snarkygal
SailorButterfly wrote:You could also use PayPal...would that make you feel better? It's supposed to be more secure. I've used PayPal since it was created and have never had a problem, but I HAVE had my debit card compromised before!


I have used PayPal and have also used my credit card many many times and have NEVER had any problems. Just be smart as to what sites you use it on.

no1


quality posts: 7 Private Messages no1
klswoot wrote:I was thinking of the zero-purchase non-designers. No1 and Andy both contribute designs, so you know they aren't hiding behind an alias when they post their comments. But, yes....Andy's awesome too. Now ....we just have to get them to find a shirt they love and get the prestigious colored-box by their name.


Hmm... this could be a reason for me to woot:

bluchez wrote:The biggest problem with any vote guessing algorithm is the people stuffing the hotness. It is IMPOSSIBLE to have anything remotely accurate as long as this is allowed to continue. From the trompe derby, my guesses were off by as much as 60 votes. I do not believe this to be a flaw in my algorithms, but an indication that at least 60 votes were removed and added back to entries ... in order to take advantage of this flaw in the system, and move the entries into the hotness when they SHOULD NOT have been.


At last, a tactic to try!

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Just a quick word of THANKS to those who voted for this design. I'm so nervous to even check in on the derby as I think the water glass is very close to the fog and I suspect that I'm in 4th, but it is still VERY EXCITING! Thank you.

And....has TGentry been on the forum yet? I wondered if he commented on his Druid Leap Year win. He must be so stunned!

sumerland3


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sumerland3
Re: Swimming Koi


If it were three goldeen I would vote for it.

Vickinator


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Vickinator

I absolutely love this design. It's beautiful.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


sumerland3 wrote:If it were three goldeen I would vote for it.


Didn't know what this meant at first....but I did a little search. Pokemon fish? Goldeen's are cute and would have looked nice...but wouldn't want to flirt with a copyright infringement issue. But, I can definitely see why you'd like a goldeen design. Thanks for the mention.


Vickinator wrote:I absolutely love this design. It's beautiful.


Thanks Vicki. I really hope this design makes it into the top 3, but there are so many wonderful designs this derby. I'm thrilled to be in the fog, but I suspect only votes separate many of the top designs. Fingers crossed.....

tiaerman


quality posts: 0 Private Messages tiaerman
SailorButterfly wrote:You could also use PayPal...would that make you feel better? It's supposed to be more secure. I've used PayPal since it was created and have never had a problem, but I HAVE had my debit card compromised before!

Also, PayPal has MEIN LIEBEN! security protocols and fraud prevention devices in place! I have used PayPal forever and have seen some of this in action. Once, my account was hijacked but PayPal caught on quickly and suspended the account until i called them and worked through the process of getting everything back up safe and secure. Also, recently paid for something I bought on Ebay using PayPal. I didn't receive the item so I filed a claim with PayPal. They reviewed the claim and realized that I had been scammed and returned the money I spent on the item to my account. It then is their responsibility to make sure that the user that didn't ship my item pays them their money. . Anyway, I could go on and on but the point is that PayPal is awesome!

There are 10 types of people: those who know binary, and those who don't.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Shucks. I had a feeling I was in 4th place. Congrats to the water for moving into the fog. Really wanted to see this design printed. Maybe it still stands a chance. Here comes my *official* plea for votes.

Zenne


quality posts: 1 Private Messages Zenne
Re: Swimming Koi


Back in the fog again! :D

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Zenne wrote:Back in the fog again! :D

Yes. But, I suspect that I have a ways to go to actually get in third place. At least me dropping out of the fog gave a little numerical information to the rest of the foggers and nearby contenders. This week is very competitive and there are several fabulous designs. Thrilled to be even remotely close to the top. I still have a little hope...but we'll just have to see what happens over the next 24 hours. TGentry pulled off a win with a similar event last week.....so fingers crossed.

haxrox


quality posts: 10 Private Messages haxrox

So that's what kls stands for. Congrats on the daily, and fantastic blog.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
haxrox wrote:So that's what kls stands for. Congrats on the daily, and fantastic blog.


Thanks Haxrox. Yes. That's me. The "L" is after my grandmother. The blog is a work in progress and hasn't been updated as much as it should. It's supposed to be a daily, but I don't always update it on a daily basis...but I try!

parkermc


quality posts: 23 Private Messages parkermc
klswoot wrote:Yes. But, I suspect that I have a ways to go to actually get in third place. At least me dropping out of the fog gave a little numerical information to the rest of the foggers and nearby contenders. This week is very competitive and there are several fabulous designs. Thrilled to be even remotely close to the top. I still have a little hope...but we'll just have to see what happens over the next 24 hours. TGentry pulled off a win with a similar event last week.....so fingers crossed.


I certainly hope it stays in the fog and moves into the top 3, if it isn't already there. This will look absolutely fantastic on a black shirt and infinitely better than any design that's practically monochromatic. Your chosen colors are very lifelike. Koi are so vibrant and that really comes across here.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


parkermc wrote:I certainly hope it stays in the fog and moves into the top 3, if it isn't already there. This will look absolutely fantastic on a black shirt and infinitely better than any design that's practically monochromatic. Your chosen colors are very lifelike. Koi are so vibrant and that really comes across here.



Thanks Parker! I'm feeling pretty nervous about the Koi's position. Haven't been around for few hours so I don't know where it stands. I still can't believe that the top 6 designs have almost 600 or more votes. WHAT AN AMAZING VOTE WEEK! I think this is the largest that I've seen since I've been on woot. WOW!!!

aaa6112


quality posts: 0 Private Messages aaa6112
klswoot wrote:Thanks Parker! I'm feeling pretty nervous about the Koi's position. Haven't been around for few hours so I don't know where it stands. I still can't believe that the top 6 designs have almost 600 or more votes. WHAT AN AMAZING VOTE WEEK! I think this is the largest that I've seen since I've been on woot. WOW!!!


Treacherous waters just dropped out of the fog...which means u were at #3 then. KEEP....GETTING...VOTES!!!!

aaa6112


quality posts: 0 Private Messages aaa6112
klswoot wrote:Thanks Parker! I'm feeling pretty nervous about the Koi's position. Haven't been around for few hours so I don't know where it stands. I still can't believe that the top 6 designs have almost 600 or more votes. WHAT AN AMAZING VOTE WEEK! I think this is the largest that I've seen since I've been on woot. WOW!!!


Treacherous waters just dropped out of the fog...which means u were at #3 (if not #2 or #1 )then. KEEP....GETTING...VOTES!!!!

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
aaa6112 wrote:Treacherous waters just dropped out of the fog...which means u were at #3 then. KEEP....GETTING...VOTES!!!!


This is too much....ahhhhh the stress! Since I fell out of the fog at 575 and treacherous waves at 595, only 20 votes likely separate mine, the glass of water and Cho's waves. WOW! That's amazingly close battle for third. AHHHHH!!! This is tough!

Can't it be Thursday noon yet?

Iambusyeating


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Iambusyeating
klswoot wrote:This is too much....ahhhhh the stress! Since I fell out of the fog at 575 and treacherous waves at 595, only 20 votes likely separate mine, the glass of water and Cho's waves. WOW! That's amazingly close battle for third. AHHHHH!!! This is tough!

Can't it be Thursday noon yet?


Not as close as last derby.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Iambusyeating wrote:Not as close as last derby.


I didn't see the vote totals last derby. Was it really close between the Lemmings, Druid and the Giraffe? I suspected they were close, but I didn't actually see the totals. What happened?

blahmcblah


quality posts: 5 Private Messages blahmcblah
Re: Swimming Koi


Even though it's a fantastic design, I wouldn't buy this because the koi kinda freak me out a little, but I have a policy of voting for anything brizz or Adder go out of their way to bash, so... GMV!


AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
blahmcblah wrote:Even though it's a fantastic design, I wouldn't buy this because the koi kinda freak me out a little, but I have a policy of voting for anything brizz or Adder go out of their way to bash, so... GMV!


I would say that if people only vote for something because brizz or I say it's crap, they're admitting it's crap, since they wouldn't vote for it otherwise.

I mean, that IS the implication, no?

aaa6112


quality posts: 0 Private Messages aaa6112
AdderXYU wrote:I would say that if people only vote for something because brizz or I say it's crap, they're admitting it's crap, since they wouldn't vote for it otherwise.

I mean, that IS the implication, no?


quoting blahmcblah: "Even though it's a FANTASTIC design....."

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
aaa6112 wrote:quoting blahmcblah: "Even though it's a FANTASTIC design....."


but he wouldn't buy it. so it's not that fantastic to him, is it?

Anyway, the point is, if he would vote for something simply because someone else disliked it, he would vote for something he himself disliked. Meaning his vote is worthless, and says nothing about the design's worth.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
AdderXYU wrote:but he wouldn't buy it. so it's not that fantastic to him, is it?

Anyway, the point is, if he would vote for something simply because someone else disliked it, he would vote for something he himself disliked. Meaning his vote is worthless, and says nothing about the design's worth.


I don't think that's a fair assessment.
He might change his mind if shirt is actually up for sale. I've done that before. I've bought derby shirts that I haven't voted for. I had a change of heart when it was actually 'revealed'.

There are designs that I've voted for because they are fantastic even if they aren't great for a shirt. I've also voted for designs that I wouldn't buy as artwork, but they look darn great on a shirt.

When it comes down to purchasing the shirt, I've also bought shirts where the design may not have been great, but I appreciate the artist's effort and I liked the artist overall. If Jimiyo hadn't shown works in progress and given us a bit of say in the overall design, I wouldn't have bought the Pirate shirt the other day...even though it's a great design. It's totally not me, but I really like him as an artist. If I didn't know Edgar from the derby, I probably wouldn't have bought his daily, but I did because I really like him as an artist and I appreciate all the effort put into his designs. It may be the only one I get for awhile and I really wanted it. In fact, I don't need any of the shirts that I've bought on woot. Almost all of them are derby shirts and they were purchased because I either appreciate the effort that was made by the artist, or I generally like them as a contributor on shirt.woot.

People vote and buy for all sorts of reasons.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
klswoot wrote:I don't think that's a fair assessment.
He might change his mind if shirt is actually up for sale. I've done that before. I've bought derby shirts that I haven't voted for. I had a change of heart when it was actually 'revealed'.

There are designs that I've voted for because they are fantastic even if they aren't great for a shirt. I've also voted for designs that I wouldn't buy as artwork, but they look darn great on a shirt.

When it comes down to purchasing the shirt, I've also bought shirts where the design may not have been great, but I appreciate the artist's effort and I liked the artist overall. If Jimiyo hadn't shown works in progress and given us a bit of say in the overall design, I wouldn't have bought the Pirate shirt the other day...even though it's a great design. It's totally not me, but I really like him as an artist. If I didn't know Edgar from the derby, I probably wouldn't have bought his daily, but I did because I really like him as an artist and I appreciate all the effort put into his designs. It may be the only one I get for awhile and I really wanted it. In fact, I don't need any of the shirts that I've bought on woot. Almost all of them are derby shirts and they were purchased because I other appreciate the effort that was made by the artist, or I generally like them as a contributor on shirt.woot.

People vote and buy for all sorts of reasons.


people can buy whyever they choose. that's their money.

Voting should be done for a good reason. That would be like people voting against my presidential candidate of choice just because I like them, regardless of his being better or worse than the other option. Voting should have some manner of integrity, or else it becomes meaningless.

It has nothing to do with your own shirt's worth or lack thereof. It has everything to do with that vote being a clear indication that a vote does not mean the voter believes he's voting for something good.

blahmcblah


quality posts: 5 Private Messages blahmcblah
AdderXYU wrote:but he wouldn't buy it. so it's not that fantastic to him, is it?

Anyway, the point is, if he would vote for something simply because someone else disliked it, he would vote for something he himself disliked. Meaning his vote is worthless, and says nothing about the design's worth.


When I said it was fantastic, I was expressing my own opinion of the design, so how could it not be fantastic to me?

I've admired a great many shirts that I haven't bought. If I bought every shirt I ever loved, I'd be more broke than I already am. I believed this design was great on its own merits, but I still might have not voted for it because there are other designs I'd rather see printed, but brizz's trashing it really forced my hand.

My vote is worth just as much as anyone else's: +1 vote. I believe that this design is plenty worthy... and if I decide to define a design's worth as its ability to get someone like you or brizz to attack it, then such a worthy design will always receive my vote.

No matter how much you whine, your votes will never count for more than mine or anyone else's. Your belief that your taste is so much better than the average voter is getting to be very tiresome. You really need to come to grips with the fact that all your pleas fall on deaf ears, that all your efforts in promoting your subjective view of the way things should be in the derby fail, and spectacularly so when they provoke the opposite reaction, as they have in me.

I can't swim, don't really like fish, and really don't have the money to spend on t-shirts I don't need, but I'm never going to let things like that keep me from voting or participating in the derby. It's fun, plain and simple, and it's posters like you that try to crush any semblance of fun out of it that will keep me coming back, even if it's just to attempt to counter your sad little crusade.


P.S.

It's 6am here. I'm a bit hungover, I haven't slept, and I have to pee. There's a fairly decent chance I won't remember any of this when I wake up.


klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Thank you for keeping this one in the running guys. It's incredibly exciting. AHHH!!! Good luck everybody. This is way too close.

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Re: Swimming Koi


Judging by hotness votes....I suspect that I'm in 4th again, no? It's been a wild ride. Thanks to those who supported this design. What a crazy last 24 hours. The next three nights are going to be exciting.

sailstud25


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sailstud25
klswoot wrote:Judging by hotness votes....I suspect that I'm in 4th again, no? It's been a wild ride. Thanks to those who supported this design. What a crazy last 24 hours. The next three nights are going to be exciting.


After this crazy fog, could it bring the Chomp back? To tell the truth, I just heard about it last week, and that derby as a whole didn't warrant it, but might this?

Hmm, just went in for 3 Randoms, when I haven't bought any shirts lately (although still checking frequently) so what are the chances of liking them!?! Oh well, couldn't pass up the mystery!
...a number of shirts on teetrade.com

blahmcblah


quality posts: 5 Private Messages blahmcblah
sailstud25 wrote:After this crazy fog, could it bring the Chomp back? To tell the truth, I just heard about it last week, and that derby as a whole didn't warrant it, but might this?


If ever there was a week for the Chomp, it's this one...


klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
blahmcblah wrote:If ever there was a week for the Chomp, it's this one...


What's the Chomp?

2thFairy


quality posts: 3 Private Messages 2thFairy
klswoot wrote:What's the Chomp?


Champ, chump, chimp, chomp

Ciono


quality posts: 1 Private Messages Ciono
Re: Swimming Koi


This is my favorite of all the "water" shirts. I'll be checking back tonight to see if it comes up. *crosses fingers*

~CodeMonkey~

klswoot


quality posts: 0 Private Messages klswoot
Ciono wrote:This is my favorite of all the "water" shirts. I'll be checking back tonight to see if it comes up. *crosses fingers*


My fingers are crossed too. This was a great derby. So many wonderful designs and I'm excited to see what prints. I very much hope to see the koi design. I think I'm going to be up every night for the next 3 nights. It's going to be an expensive week!

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
sailstud25 wrote:After this crazy fog, could it bring the Chomp back? To tell the truth, I just heard about it last week, and that derby as a whole didn't warrant it, but might this?


I hope not. And here's why.

(I know you were all hoping I'd say why).

The "Derby Chomp" is, as proven before, a fourth-place shirt which gets printed despite being 4th place. This has happened once, as a "goodwill" gesture on the derby before Christmas. There were plenty of reasons that would have happened... the christmas thing, the general closeness of votes, the fact that the Chimp and Chump were both trees in the snow, possibly Monday's submission dropping out for some reason... whatever the reason, 4th got printed. Awesome. Unexpected. But should not be the norm.

If woot wants to take it upon themselves to print shirts from this derby which didn't place, they should be able to pick from any of them. There are better options in the top ten. There are better options in the top 20. They got craploads of votes (the most I've seen in non-fog competition, at least) and will still sell as well as any other daily. They've awarded first, second and third. If they like 4th best, so be it. If not, they should print what THEY like. The voters had three chances to get what they wanted printed. Anything further should be totally at woot's discretion, not based on votes. Votes mean nothing in the derby.

sailstud25


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sailstud25
AdderXYU wrote:I hope not. And here's why.

(I know you were all hoping I'd say why).

The "Derby Chomp" is, as proven before, a fourth-place shirt which gets printed despite being 4th place. This has happened once, as a "goodwill" gesture on the derby before Christmas. There were plenty of reasons that would have happened... the christmas thing, the general closeness of votes, the fact that the Chimp and Chump were both trees in the snow, possibly Monday's submission dropping out for some reason... whatever the reason, 4th got printed. Awesome. Unexpected. But should not be the norm.

If woot wants to take it upon themselves to print shirts from this derby which didn't place, they should be able to pick from any of them. There are better options in the top ten. There are better options in the top 20. They got craploads of votes (the most I've seen in non-fog competition, at least) and will still sell as well as any other daily. They've awarded first, second and third. If they like 4th best, so be it. If not, they should print what THEY like. The voters had three chances to get what they wanted printed. Anything further should be totally at woot's discretion, not based on votes. Votes mean nothing in the derby.


That's crap imho, how can "votes mean nothing in the derby"?? Votes are the basis of the derby results! {aside: why do you dislike the koi so much?!? I believe they are up in 3rd or maybe even 2nd the way the drifting in & out of the fog was going at the end, so it may be a bit of a moot point for this design.] Just because you like other shirts in the top 10 (or even 20?!?) does not mean they are better/ would be woot's choices over the 4th place shirt.

That's the thing with a democracy... the people vote. You cannot overrule the majority just because you disagree. You are asking for woot to make derby decisions as if in a tyrany. We have observed based on comments from kls about her daily that if they like a design, they will ask the designer to make another in the same spirit. They will not just choose derby entries. If they decide the voting was close enough to reward voters who will obviously purchase a "chomp", then let them. Stop your compaining that the designs you personally liked didn't get the votes.

Hmm, just went in for 3 Randoms, when I haven't bought any shirts lately (although still checking frequently) so what are the chances of liking them!?! Oh well, couldn't pass up the mystery!
...a number of shirts on teetrade.com

geekfactor12


quality posts: 11 Private Messages geekfactor12
sailstud25 wrote:That's crap imho, how can "votes mean nothing in the derby"?? Votes are the basis of the derby results! {aside: why do you dislike the koi so much?!? I believe they are up in 3rd or maybe even 2nd the way the drifting in & out of the fog was going at the end, so it may be a bit of a moot point for this design.] Just because you like other shirts in the top 10 (or even 20?!?) does not mean they are better/ would be woot's choices over the 4th place shirt.

That's the thing with a democracy... the people vote. You cannot overrule the majority just because you disagree. You are asking for woot to make derby decisions as if in a tyrany. We have observed based on comments from kls about her daily that if they like a design, they will ask the designer to make another in the same spirit. They will not just choose derby entries. If they decide the voting was close enough to reward voters who will obviously purchase a "chomp", then let them. Stop your compaining that the designs you personally liked didn't get the votes.


It's true that in a discussion about quality, votes do not matter.

In a discussion about popularity, though, they're the only thing that matters.

Personally, I'd stop reading the forums if people only posted about how good and equal all the shirts were. I like hearing opinions about what works and what doesn't in terms of shirt design.

brizz


quality posts: 0 Private Messages brizz
sailstud25 wrote:That's crap imho, how can "votes mean nothing in the derby"?? Votes are the basis of the derby results! {aside: why do you dislike the koi so much?!? I believe they are up in 3rd or maybe even 2nd the way the drifting in & out of the fog was going at the end, so it may be a bit of a moot point for this design.] Just because you like other shirts in the top 10 (or even 20?!?) does not mean they are better/ would be woot's choices over the 4th place shirt.

That's the thing with a democracy... the people vote. You cannot overrule the majority just because you disagree. You are asking for woot to make derby decisions as if in a tyrany. We have observed based on comments from kls about her daily that if they like a design, they will ask the designer to make another in the same spirit. They will not just choose derby entries. If they decide the voting was close enough to reward voters who will obviously purchase a "chomp", then let them. Stop your compaining that the designs you personally liked didn't get the votes.


Thank you for so perfectly stating the incredibly flawed logic of this standard response to any criticism of a design. I'd just like to point out the ginormous fallacies this stance is based upon:

1. "woot is a democracy" - no it isn't. And as woot showed with it's editor's choice week, they actually will "just choose derby entries." And there are indications from Joel that they will do so again in the future...perhaps as a new wrinkle in the weekly derby. There is nothing "tyrannical" about them doing so...and to say so is laughable. It's a business....businesses are not democracies.

b. Stop equating criticism of perceived faults in one design with whining about the lack of votes for another. This is the oft repeated statement that is most annoying, and entirely false. Critiquing a design is not inherently a byproduct of regret for another's failure. Sure there may be a comparison made in a critique, but as I have made clear time and again, I don't take the time to critique a design out of spite over one I prefer laying behind it. Once again, this is a case of pot meet kettle - all of you who vote for designs that are criticized are the only one's guilty of this incredibly childish and flawed reasoning.

AdderXYU


quality posts: 38 Private Messages AdderXYU
sailstud25 wrote:That's crap imho, how can "votes mean nothing in the derby"?? Votes are the basis of the derby results! {aside: why do you dislike the koi so much?!? I believe they are up in 3rd or maybe even 2nd the way the drifting in & out of the fog was going at the end, so it may be a bit of a moot point for this design.] Just because you like other shirts in the top 10 (or even 20?!?) does not mean they are better/ would be woot's choices over the 4th place shirt.

That's the thing with a democracy... the people vote. You cannot overrule the majority just because you disagree. You are asking for woot to make derby decisions as if in a tyrany. We have observed based on comments from kls about her daily that if they like a design, they will ask the designer to make another in the same spirit. They will not just choose derby entries. If they decide the voting was close enough to reward voters who will obviously purchase a "chomp", then let them. Stop your compaining that the designs you personally liked didn't get the votes.


Except if woot picks other shirts to print, it isn't a democracy. The democracy is for the first through third shirt. Woot can print anything they want, and if they don't want #4, 5, 6, 7, but do want #8 and #10, they have every right to pick them. People want them to print a Chomp, a fourth placer, because of the votes. Woot isn't going to print anything but the top 3 for the voters. If woot chooses to print other shirts, it should be entirely their choice, regardless of what the wooters want. Because ultimately this is THEIR site. You're just buying from them.

As for overruling a majority, you certainly should be able to. Some, and indeed most, majorities are wrong. That's why America has an electoral college... the forefathers didn't trust a popular vote. Not that the electoral college has helped much when the majority is particularly dumb.

Votes in a competition like this are nothing more than popularity gauges, not quality gauges. If popularity was the only gauge worth paying attention to, people would get jobs based on being prom queen. Woot can, and should more often, decide to print derby entries based on what they consider quality. Much like their 07 editor picks, they will NOT all be top rankers.

sailstud25


quality posts: 0 Private Messages sailstud25
AdderXYU wrote:Except if woot picks other shirts to print, it isn't a democracy. The democracy is for the first through third shirt. Woot can print anything they want, and if they don't want #4, 5, 6, 7, but do want #8 and #10, they have every right to pick them. People want them to print a Chomp, a fourth placer, because of the votes. Woot isn't going to print anything but the top 3 for the voters. If woot chooses to print other shirts, it should be entirely their choice, regardless of what the wooters want. Because ultimately this is THEIR site. You're just buying from them...


I concede to your points about the Editor's choice derby... they will choose some for a second chance in the "popularity contest", but within the derby I still feel it is a democracy that woot has put into place for this entertaining little comepetition to generate designs and buyer interest, and if they deem it worthy to print an additional derby entry as the daily shirt immediately following the derby winners, it seems to me that it must be the 4th place based on other precidents they seem to have set. I don't see them choosing a shirt that they (or you guys crying out for it) determine to be better quality than a design that lots of other people apparently liked (based on the voting). Although, outside the derbies it is entirely their choice of what to do, such as beyond my refering to them approaching kls for a new design, they then moved the placement of it on her, so there you go.

Regardless, I looked back at the winter "chomp", and it did make references to being a one time only sort of thing, so I will not make any more comments requesting a chomp. Aside from that, I feel sad for the others that get bombarded by certain people voicing their critical opinions more often and louder; I challenge one and get jumped on by the louder outcriers who babble on until they feel they've proven themselves right. A lot of it continues to be opinion or speculation based on observations at best. We aren't going to be defining anything for woot in our disagreements, so I'm not going to continue playing this game of butting heads.

Take care.

Hmm, just went in for 3 Randoms, when I haven't bought any shirts lately (although still checking frequently) so what are the chances of liking them!?! Oh well, couldn't pass up the mystery!
...a number of shirts on teetrade.com

miotu


quality posts: 0 Private Messages miotu
Re: Swimming Koi


WOW, this design is AMAZING! You DEFINITELY need to make more shirts; I will be sure to buy!

PSY87


quality posts: 0 Private Messages PSY87
Re: Swimming Koi


diggin the t-shirt

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