Brilliant!!!

Re: X marks the spot

Now this one, this here is a great laugh.

GMV

Haha. If only it were that easy.

I like this!

Re: X marks the spot

Very clever.

Re: X marks the spot

Is that why people dig in their belly buttons? o.o

Re: X marks the spot

Perfect use of the shirt color, too! Love it!

Re: X marks the spot

Beautiful calligraphy, appropriate to the art of Wyeth and such.

Re: X marks the spot

Great design, Naolito! I hope this is its time. GMV.

I love this but I swear I have seen this before but just can't recall where.

Weredawg wrote:I love this but I swear I have seen this before but just can't recall where.

It was subbed on Threadless last year.

Great! +1

Re: X marks the spot

Re: X marks the spot

Yeah I saw this on Society6, very nice.

Re: X marks the spot

awesome!

Re: X marks the spot

Clever, and extremely well done!

Re: X marks the spot

I want this as a poster in my kids room. It is awesome!

Re: X marks the spot

I love colors, perspective, concept... I love all :D

Re: X marks the spot

LOVE IT !

Re: X marks the spot

I have to ask because this has never been clear to me and I know Threadless is okay with this practice but is a design which has been sold as a shirt design or being considered as in this derby okay to be sold as a print on other sites? Like Society 6

And was this design previously for sale there as well? I ask because like someone else mentioned and referred to seeing this design previously I thought the same that I had seen this design before selling on S6.

But again Threadless is okay with posting and selling prints of their design by the artist on S6 just wasn't sure what Woot's take on this as well.

midgerock wrote:...

In my case, I always disable the sale of a print when I submit it to the derby or is picked as a daily (fixed the ghost writer one, thanks for the notice).
Talking about being for sale before it goes on woot, I've never hidden to woot the fact they are on s6, even I think I've used some links to s6 in designs submissions, and they never told me nothing about it, so I always assumed that there was no problem with it...

Naolito wrote:In my case, I always disable the sale of a print when I submit it to the derby or is picked as a daily (fixed the ghost writer one, thanks for the notice).
Talking about being for sale before it goes on woot, I've never hidden to woot the fact they are on s6, even I think I've used some links to s6 in designs submissions, and they never told me nothing about it, so I always assumed that there was no problem with it...

Let me be clear, I dig the design first and for most. But the terms and conditions and from what I've heard previously from other artists is that the design can not be sold anywhere else in any form previously to be considered at woot. So if one copy of the design sold as a print or on shirt elsewhere it would be considered disqualified. I had discussed this 2 weeks ago with the cat derby when I was considering entering a design I just created and placed on redbubble for sale and was advised because it was sold that it could not be entered in the derby and disqualified from competing.

The T&C kind makes it clear how woot has exclusive rights to the design in any form including the Ghost Writer design.

"7. Grant Of Rights. Artist grants Woot the exclusive, perpetual, irrevocable, world-wide, right and license to use, reproduce, print, publish, publicly display, transmit, market, sell, distribute, and sublicense the Artwork in all forms and media now known or hereafter developed. Woot may make or authorize non-substantive changes to the Artwork to prepare it for production use.

8. Non-competition. Artist shall not use the Artwork in any manner with the sole exception that Artist may display or incorporate the Artwork in a personal portfolio or collection for promotional purposes related to Artist’s work."

But maybe woot can chime in to clarify this point further and not leave it up speculation.

midgerock wrote:...

Not sure if my english is failing but I don't see there any reference to the design not being sold before woot get the rights.
It's totally clear about selling them after the momment they get the rights though, so we think the same about this. As I said, ghostwriter case was an obvlion that I fixed thanks to your message(It didn't even ever sell anything).
But, probably for my bad english, I still no see any reference to not being sold before woot get the rights. Could you quote the exact part when it says something about this?
But obviously, if it says it, it's a clear reason of reject.

Naolito wrote:Not sure if my english is failing but I don't see there any reference to the design not being sold before woot get the rights.
It's totally clear about selling them after the momment they get the rights though, so we think the same about this. As I said, ghostwriter case was an obvlion that I fixed thanks to your message(It didn't even ever sell anything).
But, probably for my bad english, I still no see any reference to not being sold before woot get the rights. Could you quote the exact part when it says something about this?
But obviously, if it says it, it's a clear reason of reject.

This is in the FAQ regarding the derby:

"We determine that design is not exclusive to Woot - i.e., the designer (or a designate) has previously produced and distributed this design, or one substantially similar;"

I don't mean to stir this up though, as I like the shirt. Just thought that would help clarify the situation.

maximus08 wrote:...

I guess it's out of the derby then... It's a pitty but woot reaction to this situation will be a permanent aclaration of what can be do at what can't. However, I think that your quote should appear on the contract instead of the faq though...

Whatever happens, thanks for your votes and help

midgerock wrote:Let me be clear, I dig the design first and for most. But the terms and conditions and from what I've heard previously from other artists is that the design can not be sold anywhere else in any form previously to be considered at woot. So if one copy of the design sold as a print or on shirt elsewhere it would be considered disqualified. I had discussed this 2 weeks ago with the cat derby when I was considering entering a design I just created and placed on redbubble for sale and was advised because it was sold that it could not be entered in the derby and disqualified from competing.

The T&C kind makes it clear how woot has exclusive rights to the design in any form including the Ghost Writer design.

"7. Grant Of Rights. Artist grants Woot the exclusive, perpetual, irrevocable, world-wide, right and license to use, reproduce, print, publish, publicly display, transmit, market, sell, distribute, and sublicense the Artwork in all forms and media now known or hereafter developed. Woot may make or authorize non-substantive changes to the Artwork to prepare it for production use.

8. Non-competition. Artist shall not use the Artwork in any manner with the sole exception that Artist may display or incorporate the Artwork in a personal portfolio or collection for promotional purposes related to Artist’s work."

But maybe woot can chime in to clarify this point further and not leave it up speculation.

Those contract clauses are not retroactive into the past. They also don't go into effect until after the contract is signed or for the derby they go into effect after the design is entered and continue only if the design is picked by the voters/editors. So they won't effect earlier sales of the design in any form... the wording would be different if woot wanted that.

But honestly woot doesn't need a contract clause to reject for this. However the only thing I've seen woot care about is designs previously sold as shirts, especially if the design is featured on one of the other shirt-a-day sites. They stopped selling one shirt because it had been featured on Teefury in a slightly different form. They don't seem to mind print sales as I've seen quite a few designs that were sold as prints before being picked as dailies.

The derby could be different, so yeah it would be nice to get some woot staff clarification.

maximus08 wrote:This is in the FAQ regarding the derby:

"We determine that design is not exclusive to Woot - i.e., the designer (or a designate) has previously produced and distributed this design, or one substantially similar;"

I don't mean to stir this up though, as I like the shirt. Just thought that would help clarify the situation.

Ah now that's the type of wording I was looking for. This is more clear. It'll be interesting to see what woot does since the rectionator can be a bit odd at time.

Still good to know where this is in FAQ. Thanks maximus08.

midgerock wrote:I had discussed this 2 weeks ago with the cat derby when I was considering entering a design I just created and placed on redbubble for sale and was advised because it was sold that it could not be entered in the derby and disqualified from competing.

I'll admit I'm pretty new to all of this, but reading the latest posts in this thread, it almost seems like midgrerock is upset about their design not being used and naolito's great design might suffer (be disqualified).

Naolito, I and clearly many others love your design and I really hope that it is able to make it through the shenanigans.

aerc712 wrote:I'll admit I'm pretty new to all of this, but reading the latest posts in this thread, it almost seems like midgrerock is upset about their design not being used and naolito's great design might suffer (be disqualified).

Naolito, I and clearly many others love your design and I really hope that it is able to make it through the shenanigans.

Quite the contrary. I love the design and thinks very clever but as I and other artists we try to submit designs not previously sold elsewhere any form because the T&C and faqs as have been mentioned state not to.

Also to clarify further which I believe merits review is that the daily submission form asks this question which goes without saying applies to derby submissions:

answer the following:
Yes, this design has been submitted to or printed by another site

No, this design has NOT been submitted to or printed by another site

Woot appears to be asking has this printed previously. It doesn't clarify shirts only but at "another site" and Society 6 would be considered another site as I see it.

Call me cynical, but something seems off when the one who seems to be the most vocal about disqualifying a high scoring submission has not one, but two submissions with low numbers.

If this design was submitted to Threadless but not printed, then I don't see what the big problem is. Clearly folks at woot like it and would like to have it printed. If that happens then the image can be removed from other locations and woot and Naolito can make some money off of a great design.

I don't know what the precedent is, but I feel like it'd be a bad decision for Woot to disqualify a top scoring design.

aerc712 wrote:Call me cynical, but something seems off when the one who seems to be the most vocal about disqualifying a high scoring submission has not one, but two submissions with low numbers.

If this design was submitted to Threadless but not printed, then I don't see what the big problem is. Clearly folks at woot like it and would like to have it printed. If that happens then the image can be removed from other locations and woot and Naolito can make some money off of a great design.

I don't know what the precedent is, but I feel like it'd be a bad decision for Woot to disqualify a top scoring design.

well to be sure I'm not going sky rocket to the fog because of these comments. So there's nothing for me to gain but the fact that a design wins fairly. I and other artists desire fair treatment and a fair contest each week. So take that as you will. There have been many popular designs which get rejected for similar or exact reasons. So there is a precedent which artists who submit are aware of and keep track of. If this makes me the bad guy for making comment about it, then so be it.

Hey, I'm quite sure that many people already tattled on this, so why don't we just wait to see what woot decides?

There is no need to fight each other...

I understand that rules have to be adhered to. Totally agree with that. But it just seems like at times it goes a bit far in efforts to disqualify sometimes great designs. I get woot is a business and they want to sell original stuff. For some of us, like myself, this design is original. I don't spend hours on other sites. I feel like as long as the design is exclusively available on woot if selected then that should be enough.

I respect what the artists here do, but please don't act like the folks who are only here to purchase stuff and vote on designs are somehow below you. I noticed this before and that kept me from commenting for awhile and now I regret attempting to participate in things. Lesson learned.

aerc712 wrote:Call me cynical, but something seems off when the one who seems to be the most vocal about disqualifying a high scoring submission has not one, but two submissions with low numbers.

Motivations are kind of irrelevant. Rules arrrrrr rules.

aerc712 wrote:I understand that rules have to be adhered to. Totally agree with that. But it just seems like at times it goes a bit far in efforts to disqualify sometimes great designs. I get woot is a business and they want to sell original stuff. For some of us, like myself, this design is original. I don't spend hours on other sites. I feel like as long as the design is exclusively available on woot if selected then that should be enough.

I respect what the artists here do, but please don't act like the folks who are only here to purchase stuff and vote on designs are somehow below you. I noticed this before and that kept me from commenting for awhile and now I regret attempting to participate in things. Lesson learned.

No reason to regret commenthing. Just keep in mind when your comment calls sour grapes that the artist can respond.

Will wait to see, as I thought it was restricted to tee sales, not the art in other forms as well.

Will be interesting yo see the

aerc712 wrote:
I respect what the artists here do, but please don't act like the folks who are only here to purchase stuff and vote on designs are somehow below you. I noticed this before and that kept me from commenting for awhile and now I regret attempting to participate in things. Lesson learned.

outrageous accusation is outragoues. How in the seven hills of hell did you come up that I or other artists think or feel you and voters in general are beneath the them? if you're trollin' for arguments sake please troll on but please understand your claim is pure fantasy. Not for one moment in any of my comments was there any inkling of that intent stated or inferred.

Re: X marks the spot

It's a beautiful shirt. I don't care where it printed before, but if it gets rejectionated, I'd like to buy it from somewhere else!

Re: X marks the spot

I want this on a poster too.

Mavyn wrote:...Will wait to see, as I thought it was restricted to tee sales, not the art in other forms as well..

Me too . Is a awesome work, hope he continue in competition.

midgerock wrote:outrageous accusation is outragoues. How in the seven hills of hell did you come up that I or other artists think or feel you and voters in general are beneath the them? if you're trollin' for arguments sake please troll on but please understand your claim is pure fantasy. Not for one moment in any of my comments was there any inkling of that intent stated or inferred.

I'm not just trying to stir up an argument. I checked on the comments for this design because I really like it and would like to see it printed. Others initially mentioned seeing it elsewhere but as I read things over, it seemed like you were the most vocal about it being disqualified. Furthermore, it seemed, as I said before, that some of your comments were driven by the fact that you did not submit a design a previous week and were upset about that. I took that as you had a personal issue with this situation and that the motivation for the lengthy posts about how this design supposedly violates a ton of rules was motivated by your own personal issues. So, I spoke up and threw my two cents out there.

I will stand by my comment that at times, the tone in messages (here and elsewhere) defers to the artists and can be dismissive of those who are not. As a relatively new participant (which I admitted right away) and someone who has never submitted a design I will admit that I am still learning about things work here. For me, though, it seems like at times the message is "you're not an artist, you don't know enough to participate." I don't expect you to understand that Midgerock because of the perspective that you have, but this is how I've interpreted things here and on other threads.

aerc712 wrote:
I will stand by my comment that at times, the tone in messages (here and elsewhere) defers to the artists and can be dismissive of those who are not. As a relatively new participant (which I admitted right away) and someone who has never submitted a design I will admit that I am still learning about things work here. For me, though, it seems like at times the message is "you're not an artist, you don't know enough to participate." I don't expect you to understand that Midgerock because of the perspective that you have, but this is how I've interpreted things here and on other threads.

I don't know about this. For example, Narfcake has yet to submit a design, yet he pretty much dominates the forums around here.

dreadwood wrote:I don't know about this. For example, Narfcake has yet to submit a design, yet he pretty much dominates the forums around here.

Again, I'm new so there are only so many things that I've read and I don't always know who's an artist or not. I didn't know that Narfcake has not submitted a design, to go with that example. I just was trying to express that I've interpreted certain messages to have a tone of artists knowing more than non-artists. Guess I just misinterpreted everything. Disregard everything I've said.

First- Nice design Nalito. I think I have seen some mention that they have printed things like cards of a design before, but as it was not mass produced it was allowed. But as a hazy memory isn't a very useful tool to determine which is right it will be interesting to see what happens over the next few days.

aerc712 wrote:Again, I'm new so there are only so many things that I've read and I don't always know who's an artist or not. I didn't know that Narfcake has not submitted a design, to go with that example. I just was trying to express that I've interpreted certain messages to have a tone of artists knowing more than non-artists. Guess I just misinterpreted everything. Disregard everything I've said.

Artists who have printed and read their contract do know more than even other artists who have not read the contract. If you wish to know the contract I do believe that you can download it from the submission pages without any obligation to submit any art to the site.
No one will talk with the assumption that a poster knows the rules of the site they are posting on unless they have interacted with that poster previously. So anytime someone says something that looks confused about rules, the rules will be clarified first, even if ultimately it does not answer the intended question.

And unless you link the examples of artists talking down to us non-artist you will look like someone who attacked an artist and escalated it after they replied calmly and informatively.
Most replies have been that woot has the final say not the artists (in other threads too). And if someone ignores the rules the artists with the disadvantage in this competition will be the ones who follow the rules.

blanked wrote:
And unless you link the examples of artists talking down to us non-artist you will look like someone who attacked an artist and escalated it after they replied calmly and informatively.
Most replies have been that woot has the final say not the artists (in other threads too). And if someone ignores the rules the artists with the disadvantage in this competition will be the ones who follow the rules.

Okay, fine, I was wrong. I said that in my last post. I guess I just misinterpreted things and took them the wrong way. I took a risk saying what I thought and clearly that all backfired. I'm not some "troll" just trying to stir things up. I'm someone with an opinion and when I tried to express that everything just fell apart. Guess I wasn't clear enough or I really did read into things too much. Whatever it is, I'm sorry that this became such a mess. Now, please disregard everything I've said and just leave me alone.

Re: X marks the spot

Huh. I read through all these comments just to find out if anyone else wondered why the tail on the Q is so long.

Re: X marks the spot

I LOVE this!! great work

aerc712 wrote:Okay, fine, I was wrong. I said that in my last post. I guess I just misinterpreted things and took them the wrong way. I took a risk saying what I thought and clearly that all backfired. I'm not some "troll" just trying to stir things up. I'm someone with an opinion and when I tried to express that everything just fell apart. Guess I wasn't clear enough or I really did read into things too much. Whatever it is, I'm sorry that this became such a mess. Now, please disregard everything I've said and just leave me alone.

I am not and was not trying to pile on. I am trying to give you a better perspective and way to criticize in the future.

Some woot back history:
The way you responded to MR is reminiscent of what things were like in threads 1-3 years ago. When any negative comment (constructive or not) or link to a similar shirt had fans reply along the lines of: 'your just a big meanie who can't draw and is jealous, this art is the best ever and you want it to fail just help yourself print- I'm never voting for another thing you enter (or if they weren't an artist- any artist you praise) ever again!!!'
One artist with particularly rabid fans wound up getting banned for blatant IP theft, since then most of the drama has died down.

Welcome to woot.

blanked wrote:I am not and was not trying to pile on. I am trying to give you a better perspective and way to criticize in the future.

Some woot back history:
The way you responded to MR is reminiscent of what things were like in threads 1-3 years ago. When any negative comment (constructive or not) or link to a similar shirt had fans reply along the lines of: 'your just a big meanie who can't draw and is jealous, this art is the best ever and you want it to fail just help yourself print- I'm never voting for another thing you enter (or if they weren't an artist- any artist you praise) ever again!!!'
One artist with particularly rabid fans wound up getting banned for blatant IP theft, since then most of the drama has died down.

Welcome to woot.

Looking back was I a bit strong with the snark? Probably. However, at the time and still now I feel like it went a little past "these are the rules" to "wait, I got screwed by this rule, you should too!" That's why I wrote such specific comments. Because I perceived such a personal motive for the lengthy comments by just one individual, I foolishly decided to voice my opinion on what was going on. Given that the design has lasted 'til now, I think it's clear that the design will not be rejected and that whatever issues were raised, the design still met woot's requirements to be a legit entry.

Thanks for the history lesson. Given that I hadn't even heard of woot a few months ago, there's no way I could have known that. I clearly have a lot to learn about woot (apparently snark is only ok in certain cases, for example). For the record, I didn't go to the pages for Midgerock's designs to be like "Oh My Gookie! THIS PERSON SUCKS DON'T VOTE." I kept my apparently horribly wrong opinion to just this thread where I was responding to a situation that I apparently imagined.

aerc712 wrote:Looking back was I a bit strong with the snark? Probably. However, at the time and still now I feel like it went a little past "these are the rules" to "wait, I got screwed by this rule, you should too!" That's why I wrote such specific comments. Because I perceived such a personal motive for the lengthy comments by just one individual, I foolishly decided to voice my opinion on what was going on. Given that the design has lasted 'til now, I think it's clear that the design will not be rejected and that whatever issues were raised, the design still met woot's requirements to be a legit entry.

Thanks for the history lesson. Given that I hadn't even heard of woot a few months ago, there's no way I could have known that. I clearly have a lot to learn about woot (apparently snark is only ok in certain cases, for example). For the record, I didn't go to the pages for Midgerock's designs to be like "Oh My Gookie! THIS PERSON SUCKS DON'T VOTE." I kept my apparently horribly wrong opinion to just this thread where I was responding to a situation that I apparently imagined.

You just need to chill out. Lots of criticism, snark, nit-picking, and rule reciting happens around here. All people do it, artists and non-artists alike. You personally called out Midge for being jealous and petty with basically no evidence but your own warped perception.

Woot has been very strict about this artwork for sale on other sites rule before and this case does seem kinda borderline. Just because Monday has passed does not mean it won't be rejected. When an entry is in the fog during the week Woot has a meeting to discuss rejection as I understand it. It make take a day or two. I can see both sides of it, and the fact that it's never been sold as a tee shirt might save it, I can't think of any precedent offhand.

If you lose some of the "poor me" attitude and hostility you'll be fine around here, no matter your opinions.

bluetuba wrote:You just need to chill out. Lots of criticism, snark, nit-picking, and rule reciting happens around here. All people do it, artists and non-artists alike. You personally called out Midge for being jealous and petty with basically no evidence but your own warped perception.

Woot has been very strict about this artwork for sale on other sites rule before and this case does seem kinda borderline. Just because Monday has passed does not mean it won't be rejected. When an entry is in the fog during the week Woot has a meeting to discuss rejection as I understand it. It make take a day or two. I can see both sides of it, and the fact that it's never been sold as a tee shirt might save it, I can't think of any precedent offhand.

If you lose some of the "poor me" attitude and hostility you'll be fine around here, no matter your opinions.

To attempt to clarify...
I directed my comments at Midgerock because in their post they specifically stated that they had an issue with the design being submitted because of a design that they did not enter in a previous derby. I interpreted that as a more personal-based less rule-based motive. As a newbie who was joining in a derby conversation for the first time because I liked a design and wanted to see it printed, I got carried away and perhaps read into things a bit too much. Had Midgerock not mentioned their own design issue in an early post I doubt I would have made the assumption that there was a personal reason for their issue with the design. It was an honest mistake that snowballed into a freaking mess.

I regret my prediction that things may be ok with the design at this point. I got caught up in stuff and was hopeful that since it did make it through the day that it'd be ok, but until the derby's complete nothing's final.

I have a lot to learn. I'll sit back, read more, learn more, and be careful when commenting in the future.

Re: X marks the spot

Such a stunning idea and awesome execution Naolito. This is one of the stand-outs of the derby.

midgerock wrote:outrageous accusation is outragoues. How in the seven hills of hell did you come up that I or other artists think or feel you and voters in general are beneath the them? if you're trollin' for arguments sake please troll on but please understand your claim is pure fantasy. Not for one moment in any of my comments was there any inkling of that intent stated or inferred.

Hell has seven hills?? Cool, who knew!

Re: X marks the spot

And it's out

Naolito wrote:And it's out

Sorry matey, Woot, she be a jealous old sea-hag who be unwillin' to share her treasures with other scalliwags!

It really was a nice fit for this derby though.

Naolito wrote:And it's out

Aww. I even voted for it on threadless, so long term sad from me.


@aerc712 Want to hear some fun rules lawyering?
Woot has a rule that something that has been submitted previously has to be significantly reworked (no direct resubs). But since this hadn't been submitted at woot specifically, he didn't need to change anything.

This was a gorgeous design. I voted for it and was really pulling for it to win. So disappointed to see it rejected.

Naolito wrote:And it's out

Sorry Naolito! I was really hoping this one would get printed, too. :-(

aerc712 wrote:I have a lot to learn. I'll sit back, read more, learn more, and be careful when commenting in the future.

Hang in there. I think you've got a good plan there. Just keep in mind that we try to promote constructive criticism on the art itself.

Re: X marks the spot

Such a shame, sorry to see it disqualified Naolito.

Re: X marks the spot

Thanks everyone for your suport, I'll keep trying!

bluetuba wrote:Sorry matey, Woot, she be a jealous old sea-hag who be unwillin' to share her treasures with other scalliwags!

It really was a nice fit for this derby though.

Agreed. I really liked this one, but the Rejectionator hath spoken.